DM: Women avoiding new gender neutral toilets in the home office because men can't close the door

Like how they pissed up the walls at that university.

In this specific scenario, however, the men could be subjected to disciplinary proceedings. They should do this.

Or even better, follow the legal guidelines for separate single sex spaces.

The men will also be unhappy about these new arrangements, don't forget, and this might also be a protest. Well if you're going to make me use the toilets with women, take my urinals away, have me queue, I'm ot going to be civilised about it.

I don't know if people were not interested, this thread seems relevant to me.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3336619-British-toilet-association?msgid=80236708#80236708

I do think some of the men will do it as a power thing, yes, I should add.

it's not often I say anything in defence of men but if you did grow up seeing open urinals, then you did grow up hearing the message that it's okay.

If you make toilets unisex

Many men will piss in the sink / outside etc as they will not wait (anti social fuckers)
Women will have their queues made longer by the ones who will wait, and by all the ones who need a shit.

Great.

there's not much point telling men to close the door when there's these revolting open urinals all over the country now

there's even some along the river in Paris now apparently?

so men have it in their heads that they can pee in full view of everyone, they are being taught this from a young age if they live in any city in Europe it seems. So they are not going to care if the sign says "close the door".

yet another argument for single sex facilities.

viques yes I saw that!

The mayor (or whoever) said we must provdie this to stop men urinating on the street

A woman said what are you going to provide for women? Litter trays? It's sexist. Men should fucking well learn to behave themselves, as women do.

Remember that story in amsterdam? where a woman got fined for urinating in the street, the judge said she should have used the open air urinal designed for men...!!! There was an outcry.

Giles I'm not infantilising anyone.

Most men I know piss with the door open at home (unless there are guests.

I mean I often piss with the door open at home! It's hardly unusual.

I do think they could if they wanted to obviously and I suspect there is an element of why should I bother, but I suspect it's down to laziness rather than wanting to expose themselves / upset women.

Apparently there is a big hooha in Paris ATM about their new Eco open air urinals(for men of course because only women are physically able to contain their urine until they get to somewhere with a proper toilet). Some of the urinals have been sited in sensitive places eg overlooking the river in full view of any passing boat and passengers. What made me sigh heavily though was a picture of one of the urinals complete with a stream of urine running across the pavement , even when they are pandered to and given decent facilities it appears some men are incapable of using them properly.

Reminded me of wheeling my buggy past Highbury and Islington Station when Arsenal were playing at home - the side wall of the station was used as a urinal, in full view of station staff and police, and the resulting urine was like a raging torrent.

I also don't think the men are likely to be doing it on purpose to upset anyone

I agree that it's likely a combination of
Not used to shutting the door so not automatic

But hang on a minute. All these men are potty trained lost likely predominantly by their mothers.who are obviously women.

Plus they are pretty bloody good at shutting the door and hiding for hours on the toilet with their iPhones whole the wife chases the kids around down stairs.

Stop infantalising men and excusing what is clearly purposeful behaviour

I think the claim from the DM that they spent £8k on a sign is probably bullshit though!

I also don't think the men are likely to be doing it on purpose to upset anyone.

I agree that it's likely a combination of
Not used to shutting the door so not automatic
Point about it being v tricky to get in and shut door with sanitary bin is highly pertinent. + men tend to be bigger than women so potentially will have to squish themselves in even more.

The idea of having single rooms out onto a shared corridor, each with their own sink etc is fine (although men won't want to queue). The idea of having the usual bathroom setup with 3 unisex cubicles is much less fine.

Essentially both the men and the women are inconvenienced by this (unless all the women stop using the work toilets thus freeing them entirely up for the men which is what seems to have happened here. A win for equality and no mistake).

"Men hardly ever seem to be close the door and both I and a friend have walked into 'gender neutral' toilets (two different bars on different occasions) to be faced with a man with his penis out pissing in the sinks because the cubicles were occupied."

This.

Post-offence reporting is not safeguarding.

This! It really fucks me off when people say 'well if something happens then just report it to the police'.

May as well not bother with any safeguarding then at all ever. Mixed sex everything and no child protection measures for anything. Because anyone can report to the police if something bad happenes right?

At work we have single occupant (a small room with a proper door and the sink is inside) unisex loos, and I think that all single occupant loos should be unisex and placed carefully within a building to ensure that women aren't dragged into the loos by hostile men.

Any multiple occupant loo (a big room with flimsy cubicles) should be single sex for the privacy, dignity, and safety of the women using the female loos.

Post-offence reporting is not safeguarding.

Quoll
BRILLIANT you have hit the nail on the head. I never thought of it that way before.
Same sex toilets ARE inherently gender neutral just as they are.

They could have saved all this by having people understand that toilets segregated by sex only, are already gender neutral.

that is an excellent point. same sex gender neutral. that needs to catch on!

That's disgusting.

Fortunately, we don't have unisex toilets at my work but it is becoming increasingly common in bars. Men hardly ever seem to be close the door and both I and a friend have walked into 'gender neutral' toilets (two different bars on different occasions) to be faced with a man with his penis out pissing in the sinks because the cubicles were occupied.

My university renovated the library and installed unisex toilets. I was too scared too use them in the late hours (the library was 24 hrs) with not many people around so I had to use the disabled toilet.

So if the Home Office only provide unisex cubicle toilets in the same room for both males and females with no separate single sex or enough single room facilities they are breaking the law?

This is the legislation on toilets at work:

www.hse.gov.uk/contact/faqs/toilets.htm

Isn't there law stipulating that male and female toilets have to be provided in the workplace? Not in the EA, in a different law?

They could have saved all this by having people understand that toilets segregated by sex only, are already gender neutral.