Channel 4 appoints a new advisor on inclusion

To be fair, rich white men from public schools getting all the notice is hardly confined to the trans world ...

Shon Faye describes herself as a transsexual on instagram

www.instagram.com/shon.faye/?hl=en

A comment below the link I gave re Shon Faye.

While I wouldn't ever wear eye makeup (it's not my thing) I regularly use my wife's concealer. Removing bags from under my eyes or a spot that's particularly angry makes me feel better about the way I look. My wife doesn't care and neither do my family - in fact, it was my wife who first suggested it!

Does this person realise what they are admitting to?

Shon Faye is also a trans woman.

She is a trans woman because she was born a male and lived as a male until mid 20s before deciding to wear dresses. Thankfully Shon discarded the blue eye shadow and now prefers the natural look.

www.theguardian.com/fashion/2014/dec/06/my-life-in-makeup

Agreed slothslothsloth, I've seen a lot of rhetoric imported wholesale from the US and applied to a completely different set of circumstances, inequality levels, welfare provision, racial politics, access to healthcare etc. It's tin-eared.

Forgive me if I say that I don't often believe what I'm told.

Especially when it comes to surgery posted on social media.

That message was to Sloth

Zeugma Thanks, I know there are a lot of contributers perhaps she will if there's a Vol II?

I never think of the US when it comes to trans inclusion or politics. To me the US is another country but obviously one for old white men.

I don't see Shon Faye mentioned in the list of alumni of posh schools... Shon attended Queen Elizabeth in Bristol - fees are £14,440 a year.

It's quite a pattern, isn't it?

I am quite surprised they had surgery, which is unusual for this type

It really isn't, particularly for much older transitioners.

Did Sue Pascoe contribute a chapter?

Just had a quick shufti at the first few pages (thanks, Amazon 'Look inside' feature!) and it seems not, @R0wantrees

Sorry that was in response to you pachyderm

I believe we have, as in many social justice matters, imported a lot of the thinking re: trans people from the US, where there really is a strong strand of poor trans women, many of whom are are PoC. I don’t see this group of trans people existing in the UK to the same extent, but everyone talks about UK trans people as uber-marginalised nonetheless.

I have been observing my local TRAs and acolytes for the last few years and they are OVERWHELMINGLY affluent middle class. It's really striking; the briefest bit of research and you get the private education, nice neighbourhood, parents who are well connected and frequently high up in media/academia. It's so blatantly a made-up load of decadent nonsense that when I see the "inclusion" buzzword I just think oh fuck off

Although I read about this at the time, I'm finding this difficult to believe, all over again. Particularly in the light of the fact that Jesse Bradley had meetings at MESMAC.

It makes you wonder why Sue Pascoe would want to be associated with it.

"And I can honestly say that the work that trans people do for each other means that, for me at least, the trans community is a beautiful place to be. Despite our differences, we have each others' backs"

Jess Bradley' 'To My Trans Sisters'
edited by Charlie Craggs (publ Oct 2017)

Did Sue Pascoe contribute a chapter?

Blimey that was cheap!

I wonder if OMELC the premier transgender surgery institute is where Sue Pascoe had her surgery?

@R0wantrees Well, colour me shocked:

'She was left devastated when doctors told her she would potentially have to wait up to four and a half years to have gender correction surgery on the NHS.

She said: “If I had had to wait that long I would have been dead, and that’s not just me being dramatic. To save my own life, I had to become Sue.”

Instead Sue turned to help from abroad, visiting acclaimed gender surgeon Dr Narendra Kaushik, head of Olmec Transgender Surgery Institute in Delhi, India, in November 2014.

Sue underwent breast augmentation surgery, as well as botox and stem cell injections, and also embarked on a course of advanced hormone treatments before leaving to return to the UK.

She subsequently returned to Dr Kaushik’s clinic in March 2015 for full gender correction surgery, as well as a range of facial surgery including cheek and chin implants, a nose job, a mini face lift and liposuction under her chin.

In total Sue spent £9,000 on surgery – although she estimates the bill could have been more than £40,000 if she had had the work done privately in the UK.'

From a site called Our Queer Stories

I still can;t find the extended interview with Sue Pascoe on Sky News but from the thread below, I commented:

"She drew equivilance with gay conversion therapy and gay rights from 20 years ago (is that the section 28 ref?)

Said that things had been fine but became toxic and this was driven by a marginal fringe group.

Said Uk had now imported from the US bathroom bill bigoty and hate.

Referenced the negative press and said this made her afraid.

Said 'many of these critical people are lesbians... very loud, very critical' and that they characterise this as a war between women and transgender people.

Her women friends think they are 'fringe people with strange views' "

Yorkshire farming hunting women friends??

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3310935-Sky-news-article-Womens-rights-hanging-by-a-thread-with-changes-to-transgender-law-by-Dr-Nicola-Williams?pg=3

Although I did say to DH WTF does this person know about being discriminated against and he said well a lot of people really dislike people who hunt foxes so maybe it's that :D

In any case ,very wealthy people are not suitable for these types of roles, especially people born into wealth. Wealth and class can easily mitigate some of the worst effects of belonging to certain marginalised groups, meaning some people may tick boxes but really know very little about the real issues.

People can advise on inclusion issues on the things that they have expereince of, and can bring voices of those with other issues.

So eg unless you are disabled it's hard to understand the barriers that exist to doing often quite standard stuff (I think there is an overlap between accessibiltiy and inclusion).

I do think that D&I is a reasnable topic.

However with 53 years or whatever of life as a white "alpha male" with a highly lucrative successful career and the fox hunting stuff etc I really don't understand what sort of insights this person can bring.

They've only "come out" as trans for a couple of years and have said most people have been very supportive and now they havegot this job. I don't see where they have experinced the kind of "designed out" that some groups face (everything built for default able bodied unencumbered average sized male) nor any of the kind of structural oppression / bias that other groups get from the get-go.

When it comes to C4 are they going to be advising on inclusion when it comes to programming (so issues around vision or hearing difficulties, stuff around different groups and programming making sure that it doesn't focus on one tranche of society) OR is it about inclusion in jobs at C4 for people who do not fit the "default" template ie hiring practices unconscious bias etc? Both?

OR will it be about asking pronouns before interviewing anyone + language like "menstruators" and maybe stopping talking about stuff as "women's issues"?

Yes as hackmum says there are many who do face lots of intersecting challenges, but I do actually agree hipsterfun that it’s not a job for one person. You really need a different person to represent different groups.

There are quite a few people who have faced a broad range of challenges. Take Linda Bellos: black, working-class, Jewish, lesbian. Oh, and also an evil TERF bigot, apparently.

Heathcliffe Bowen was a trustee of MESMAC and a director of its trading arm.

He was jailed in January 2018 for sexual offences against boys.

www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/crime/paedophile-ex-council-chief-was-also-trustee-of-child-abuse-charity-1-8990165