Museum of London - why female-only toilets were so important

As posters have already said, the worry women have is from people abusing a more open system.
Women and transsexuals have been quietly using the same facilities for years.

I second everything Yambabe said. And it really sucks that the transsexuals who see the problem with self-ID are just not being heard in this "debate" at all.

Steph most women are not bothered about old-school transsexuals in the toilets. They've looked the other way for decades because the numbers were very small and there was little or no perceived threat.

The issue is that by widening the trans umbrella and then saying anyone who wants to can self-id as a woman Stonewall and the TRAs who are shouting for this are effectively opening up a loophole to allow any old pervert in because they can say they are a woman and entitled to be there.

We're not worried about trans people in our intimate spaces. We're afraid of perverts and abusers.

Sadly it seems that the genuine transsexuals who just want to pee in peace lose either way. Open up the ladies and the abusers follow them in. Segregate by natal sex and they are barred from going where they feel comfortable. It's shit.

have you not been following the south korea spy cam issue stephLDS18 ?

I feel there are more men posting on this thread than women!

Because toilets are important. There is a difference between having a rule with some exceptions, and saying that anyone is allowed in.

We discussed a recent case of two young girls being assaulted in a female toilet by a male on a thread today:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3329936-teen-films-girl-in-toilet

When will the contributors to this board stop obsessing over toilets? Can someone cite figures for the number of trans women convicted of attacking users of female toilets anywhere in the UK over say the past 10 years? I suggest the figure is probably zero or very near.

Sorry posted too soon, I don't care what the person in the next cubicle is doing and hopefully they don't care what I am.

Why can't all toilets be cubicles and all unisex, no urinals and no fear

What's the solution for non-binary people, Wherismymind?

I can't belive people are still banging on about a third space. It's not going to happen.

Who will pay for this third space? It would cost billions and for what 1% of the population. Its not going to happen.

Trans people don't want a third space because they don't want to be "other" they want to be their chosen gender. So they're not going to campaign for it.

Thanks OP, what a brilliant reminder of why we need women-only facilities.

ironically, the Museaum of London is largely funded and controlled by the Corporation of London - see threads passim

When I first saw gender neutral toilets at the Barbican, I thought 'ooooh, how progressive'...then I went to the ICA.

The gender neutrals toilets there were just a sight. And a bomb site. Whacking great urinal at the side...and one cubicle with a loose door on it. So, basically, they'd taken the 'male' sign off the door and done bugger all else. I don't want to walk in and see a penis urinating. My BF went in after me and came out looking a bit worse for wear [finally. He gets a taste of what being a woman (fuck knows how to phrase this any longer) is like]. He said, 'I wouldn't want to be at the urinal when a man OR woman walked in.'

Have gender neutral toilets all you want, but make them purely one space i.e. you open the door and you can lock that door. There shouldn't be cubicles or partitioned spaces.

My thoughts too - happy! What is wrong with a 3rd space? Surely the extra special- ness of it should satisfy some of the TRAs and perpetually aggrieved trans groups? No?

I really don’t understand why trans women don’t campaign for gender neutral facilities ALONGSIDE sex segregated ones- the world we live in today, with everyone having a camera on their phone, makes it even more important that women & girls can pee without fear of a man filming them or worse. If trans make up approx .5 % of the population & women 51%, they are surely fighting a loosing battle trying to force themselves into women’s only spaces.

Thank for this Pearl

I have just emailed to see if the loo paper can be bought to use in conjunction with other campaigning etc. You never know!