What ARE the "gender traits" of a woman?

Non-Binary Traits

• Grandiose ideas of being so special that they can't fit into any category

Nailed it

I deliberately never gave my daughter dolls etc. She never asked for them or played with them despite having access to them at nursery etc. She chose Lego, art materials, cars and books. She told me dolls were boring!

Langcleg DH is afraid of spiders, so as I am not, I get to deal with all spiders in our house. I'm afraid of heights so he gets to drive in mountainous regions. I've been having a think about this and he and I both have what are traditionally seen as masculine and feminine traits, about half and half each. We complement each other very nicely.

What babyteeth said

Understands, through lived experience, the negative effects of our patriarchal planet on girls and women and can empathise with the other girls and women who have experienced the same.

I'm scared of spiders to the extent that I stand on the sofa screaming and crying if one appears. Does that count?

Much less likely to be violent?

Holly Willoughby?
Loves unicorns and sparkle
Vocal fry
Has many children and wants more
Boobs and cleavage and blonde and teeth
Giggles a lot
Loves to look a bit thick so as to highlight Schofield’s incredible intelligence

My dad knitted all our baby clothes... my mum can't even sew a button on properly.

"Gender traits" are sex role stereotypes that vary from culture to culture and are enforced through various means from punitive laws to social disgrace.

Women learn from the womb to budge up to make room for men and boys, and men learn from the womb to expect that to happen. You only have to spend 5 minutes on the relationship board to see that. And I know NAMALT and NAWALT. But enough are to make it the norm, and for the men and women that don’t to be noticed and remarked on.

I would have put what other posters put! I do love makeup and wearing nice clothes. I can’t knit and have never had any desire to do so. I never had dolls as a child and neither did my daughter.

I'd never thought of that, SilentCrow. If you can sew/knit garments then you aren't subject to the vagaries & whims of the clothes sizing industry in the same way as the rest. I remember a conversation years ago when I was knitting for my first baby and my FiL, now dead, made some comment that showed he knew about knitting. So I asked him if he could knit 'oh no!' he said. But he could, because he'd been on the Russian convoys in WW2 where they spent their downtime knitting to keep themselves warm on those icy seas. The interesting juxtaposition of manly activities (war) with womanly ones (knitting).

All real women carry a bag of knitting (or other feminine like activity such as crochet or cross-stich)

These people have clearly never seen Subversive Cross Stich and similar:

shop.subversivecrossstitch.com/collections/all-kits

I think my favourite is "This is proof I have the patience to stab something 1000 times".

Actually this "craft is girly" thing gets right up my nose and is, yet again, a white middle class man's point of view. For one, it's still within living memory that most working class men could knit - soldiers, sailors, all sorts. Sadly my grandfathers are gone now, but I'm willing to bet their WW2 brothers in arms could knit, sew and leatherwork. Why devalue that skill and dump it on to women unless it's about showing off your money and status?

Secondly it's a pushback against being self-sufficient. A woman who can make her own clothes, adjusted to her fit, immediately buys out of the "perfect model body" narrative (and it's curious how fabric and yarn prices have rocketed up since it became fashionable again).

Thirdly, devaluing "women's" crafts aims to reduce their political power. Why is an embroidered banner less important than a spray-painted wall?

Slight tangent to the thread, I guess, but this devaluing of message because of the medium in which it's expressed really bugs me.

Long hair. People my age will remember grandads saying "I thought he was a girl!" because the popstar had long hair. Or "I thought she was a boy!" because the girl didn't. How we laughed! But we are living once more in the age of the grandads.

You forgot knitting…

All real women carry a bag of knitting (or other feminine like activity such as crochet or cross-stich)
And then when involved in important discussions knit passive aggressively to remin them all that you’re a real woman.

Vulnerability as a 'loveable female trait'? Is that because it makes us so much easier to manipulate and hold down? FFS.

Shit, that 'feminine traits we love: a women's day celebration' list include vulnerability.

Yes, India Willoughby kindly explained that hair on a woman's legs is dirty. I imagine the sight of hair on certain other parts of the anatomy would cause India to have a seizure.

Also women have no body hair, don't get sweaty, have no bodily functions (especially noisy or smelly ones), and enjoy wearing extremely uncomfortable shoes that make their feet bleed & prevent them from moving any faster than a slow totter.

Don't forget that exclusively female trait of 'multi-tasking' . Whenever it's mentioned, always by a man, I can't help pointing out that its just bollocks men say to get women to do everything.

I had a breakthrough conversation with DP about gender the other day. He finally understands the difference between gender and sex, and I think it's going to be tremendously helpful moving forward with our GNC daughter.

It hinged on him recognizing that gender has a negative effect on men, of course, with ideas like 'big boys don't cry' and so on. But once he saw the demonstrably stupid rules like that about male 'gender', instead of defending the 'positive' male gender rules like 'provider' etc. he began to see how much it restricted everyone.

This is significant because of our history as part of very strict Christian genderism and the hangover that leaves you with. We talked about how my son is the most empathetic of my children, and how his favourite activities as a kid were carrying a handbag with random junk in, pushing a pushchair and cooing over babies. Things which were pegged as 'feminine', but that actually made no rational sense.

Take your blood pressure tablets before you read this article. It's about a femme-presenting (no, me neither) trans man who hasn't changed pronouns. The person concerned knows they're a man, though, because they don't wear make up any more. Or possibly they do now. I lost the will to live part way through.

take football - a child playing football in the UK is more likely to be a boy, whereas in the US it's more likely to be a girl soccer being a "girls sport" there. How do genderists work that one out? What happens if the child's family moves countries? Do they need to change sports? Or just be boringly gender conforming rather than super special?