Excellent counter-view to ROGD

More reading for Garam: www.jahonline.org/article/S1054-139X(16)30765-0/abstract?code=jah-site

Gawd blimey, it's too bloody hot for this bollocks.

No garam, I will not be ignoring the evidence of my own eyes that my child was simply a GNC female until she hit puberty and the 'net and decided that her naturally occuring personality meant she was the opposite sex.

Because medicalization based on regressive stereotypes and a fundamental misunderstanding of how girls feel about their bodies especially during puberty is a shitty, shitty thing.

But apart from that, I'm going back to lying prone by a fan and continue to watch Bowl skilfully take your crappy arguments apart, because I know full well the 'balance' you have provided today will serve very well as an illustration of the complete bankruptcy of your beliefs.

Garam have a read : www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5841333/

We are building a new person. Why would anyone want to erase themselves so much that this is the standard protocol? Surely someone needs to explore why the person hates them self so much?
This is the key factor for me. If an adult wants to undergo unnecessary surgery that is one thing but to allow a child to do it is quite another. Imagine allowing your ten year child to tattoo her whole face with scales because she felt more comfortable as a dinosaur. And that's just an aesthetic change. If that seems ridiculous (and it should) then why would self-hate or even self-discomfort justify mutilation and sterilisation?
Especially as in adult straight males with AGP, self-hate, self-discomfort or any form of dysphoria is deemed unnecessary?

Sorry, Tww, you probably gathered that wasn't aimed at you!

garam

When you use the word 'trans', what cohort of people are you referring to?

Is it people with gender (or sex) dysphoria - a revulsion with their sexed bodies which they desire to change to look like that of the opposite sex?

Or is it people who like to dress and behave like the opposite sex, but have no problem with their bodies?

Or is it men with a fetish who like to imagine themselves as women, and change their bodies accordingly - but not necessarily lose their penis?

Or some other group? Or all of them, since they are all under the 'trans' umbrella?

Because it's important that we know which group of people we're referring to.

For the first group, it would be better if they could accept their bodies, if at all possible.

For the second group, no treatment is necessary.

The third group is irrelevant as far as children are concerned, but are still referred to as 'trans'.

Garam have a read: www.tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1080/00332925.2017.1350804

I don't believe you.

That's what this comes down to.

I don't believe that two of the three girls I know with ROGD had any problem whatever with their birth sex before they hit the internet in their teen years.

The oldest might have. I suspect Asperger's has a lot to do with it in that case, though.

Another is gay, from a strictly religious family who were unlikely to accept it.

The third is from a chaotic multi-'uncle' household, and the possibility that she falls into the third category of 'autistic, lesbian, abused' worries me quite a lot.

vimeo.com/185149379

Is this the expert we should listen to?
If this was true then I have to say my child is not trans as nothing in this was ever displayed by my child.
Social isolation, bullying by peers, anxiety and internet binging on sites have contributed to self diagnosis of trans.
Please hear our voice and help our kids work through puberty first. ROGD is occurring because kids no longer understand puberty and if they feel an outsider which most do during these tumultuous years the trans narrative gives them some sense of validation. Also non conforming children are being steered into a identity that pitches them as the other sex. Parents are not doing this. Trans adults who align themselves with this new ideology are.
You ask us to trust these people over professionals and parents who understand puberty and who understand mental health issues and who understand feelings change.

Since the transgender ideology also says gender can change on a daily bases or you actually can have no gender, how can you insist transgender is something you were born with?
The narrative does not make sense yet we are being forced to believe this.
Why then is ROGD not allowed any credence?
You are redefining sex, language and the diagnosis of Transgender yet you are not allowing other people the same curtesy.
I know my truth and that is this ideology is attempting to erase the sexes. Suddenly I am c** woman. No one asked me if I agreed to this. The trans narrative invented it.

Arguing and debating this is difficult because once one thing is proved incorrect, the trans ideology invent new terms and new ways to put the message across

Now our kids no longer need to have gender dysphoria.

If this is true then basically our kids are just kids who are expressing their personality

Should a personality be treated to hormones and surgery. Just to be clear
Surgery is double mastectomy, hysterectomy, testicle removal, penile inversion to make a hole and because this still isn’t enough to make the person feel like a woman, feminising facial surgery and breast implants. We are building a new person.
Why would anyone want to erase themselves so much that this is the standard protocol?
Surely someone needs to explore why the person hates them self so much?
Surely the person who goes through this has psychological issues?
Or am I just being too thick to understand?
If I as a non professional can ask these questions, and told because it is a feeling and feelings can not be challenged, does this mean I can say and do whatever I want because of my feelings?
We know this would not be allowed. Yet this is what trans ideology proposes. If this is acceptable then
What next???

To digress slightly, there is a very real difference between coming out as a homosexual or as a trans person. If a child or young person comes out as gay, and later changes their mind, or lives as a straight person, and comes out as gay later in life (as many women do), there is no lasting physical damage to the individual. A few years "experimenting" with lesbianism in uni isn't going to lose a girl her breasts or her fertility.

Just to clarify, by ‘the treatment varies’ I mean “how society treats gay people’, not ‘medical treatment’.

It's only medical for children, right? For grown men it's a lifestyle choice? Or did I get that bit wrong?

It means they were in the closet............... then they came out.

What do you mean in the closet?

Gender dysphoria is a medical condition. It's not a diversity tick.

How can a medical condition be in the closet????

the numbers will keep increasing, as more and more people come out as trans
Year on year, perhaps. But the chart doesn't show a cumulative increase. You could show a cumulative increase in people becoming firefighters if you just showed how many signed up each year (and ignored anyone who left or retired or died). It would be disingenuous, as the public wouldn't have any more actual firefighters. What the chart actually shows is an increase per year, so more people becoming firefighters in this year than last year, more last year that the year before, etc. An actual increase. In firefighters, or in children medicalised by this process.

f it isn't, and you actually believe what you just typed, then god bless you, I wish you all the luck in the world....

The proportion of people who are homosexual is fairly constant across cultures and time. The only thing that changes is how accepting a society is and how visible that population can safely be - the actual rates of people being gay is fairly constant.

As you’d expect, it being inbuilt, and natural.

Are you saying the incidence of homosexuality changes? Because that’s what your post implies, but as PPs say it’s not terribly clear...

why is that funny?

Whether it’s socially acceptable or not, The population of gay men and lesbian women is fairly constant. The treatment varies. The orientation is across times and cultures. And we can see that from history.

I don’t think you’ve understood my point, to be honest.

Garam, I expect you think you are making sense, but I'm not getting much information from your posts.

What do you find comical about the % of gay and lesbian people being pretty consistent?

Dear Lord, IcyNoII. Are you a teenager?

When I say deviantART it comes out as deviantART. It just does.

The name of the person who wrote the thread in the OP takes you to an anime site. The name of the person in the opening post is Japanese.

I said I don't speak Japanese, so it might not be anything. But I was unsurprised that it was anime. I still am.

The number of late transitioning men who are interested in anime is huge. It's almost guaranteed.

None of this is a surprise.

But in the interests of this thread, what is your explanation for ROGD? And 12 girls acquiring it simultaneously?

WHY are you saying that ROGD doesn't exist in the face of people saying that their child has
gender dysphoria
which had
rapid onset?

When 'transgender' was confined to transsexuals, the numbers were small, and this aggressive, misogynistic campaigning was unheard of.
This x100

"I don't type. I use speech recognition. And that's how deviantART appeared. All by itself.

Try it."

I just did. Sounds like "Deviant Art" slightly run together when run through text-to-speech. Definitely sounds English. Doesn't sound Japanese. Just ran a Google search on the term using voxrecog.

Now writing this section using voice to text software. Deviant Art. DeviantArt. deviantArt.

Back to typing.

Nope. No Japanese there.

So we're back to the explanation that you were mudslinging hoping that people will think 'deviant' means something naughty.

tut tut