Excellent counter-view to ROGD

Datun is not a saint! But she is incredibly knowledgeable about the topic under discussion. I'd drop the argument and stick to the purpose of the thread @IcyNoII

Honestly many of us are way too personally involved in this very serious issue to be swayed over discussion of one website or it's name etc.

This is a serious issue affecting a lot of young people. The exact details of one site are not relevant.

Datum is very knowledgeable, please do not pick a fight with her. It will not end well.

It would seem so!

Are people really monitoring parenting forums to make sure that nobody criticises DeviantArt and gets away with it?

Interestingly, Steve Wright's alter ego is Silly Boy

Yeah come on women, teenage girls may be suffering but someone slighted anime on the internet.

"Its just you seemed to be doubting that it had come up on datun search"

Doubtin' and confused. Datun claimed that the name led to an anime site and it was all Japanese or something. So I typed in sakuranoseirei.com and it led nowhere. Then she was claiming the name led to an anime site called 'DeviantArt' and it was all Japanese or something. But then DeviantArt isn't an anime site and is in English, so that made no sense neither. So I figured maybe Datun's getting confused by that there Twitter handle so I posted all the links you'd ever need to translate the name. Turns out the name on that Twitter handle is Sakura. Which, you know, people here know cause they've been posting about it and all, but still trying to claim that it's all porn or something (which is weird and all, Sakura is pretty much the most popular girls name given to babies in Japan, so I don't know what it is about people's web histories that's making search engines find porn for them for a very popular girls name). And hey ho, you type Sakura into Google and what do you get? Assuming you haven't trashed your search parameters looking for that there porn and all, turns out its a bunch of restaurants and such like near me, but guessing that's because of my location.

"But you carry on, i can tell youre[sic] a fan"

You betcha I'm fan of DeviantArt. One of the best communities around for offering advice, help, and free use of resources, including the use of stock, for artists and graphics designers starting out, and for authors who design the covers of their own books. Hard enough trying to start a career in any of those things without being burdened down by real heavy costs in royalties and license payments and all. Seeing people on a public website that claims to be popular in England publicly trashing the site, trying to put off future artists and designers, lots of whom are women at that, from using it? That there pushes my buttons real hard.

There's a lot of words I could use, but let's say effective isn't one of them.

OMG is it Steve Wright?

Quack quack oops.

Three words I never thought would be applicable to a MN thread.

I'm afraid I'm going to have to hold you completely responsible for everything!

And I'm going to get very, very angry.

There's a lot of words I could use, but let's say effective isn't one of them.

I only went off for one bloody day. And it's all gone weird!

Datun: the current formatting of the website name is DeviantArt. But it used to be deviantART. So your speech recognition is out of date. I'm afraid I'm going to have to hold you completely responsible for everything!

lang

I think we are at the

Making shit up

Stage

Is there some stylistic implication to the g-dropping that I am unaware of?

OMG is it Steve Wright?

In these parts, we're inclined to notice bees in bonnets!

Is there some stylistic implication to the g-dropping that I am unaware of?

"I'm sure all this anime chat is very interesting to you, but it's really boring to most of us and nothing to do with the thread."

Was not I who pointlessly dragged anime into this discussion.

It was, to quote another poster, "the saintly Datun" who started wildly claiming something about anime that had nothing to do with anything. Same Datun who went on to claim that DeviantArt was an anime website. And when shown it wasn't, wellum, just repeated that there debunked claim it were an anime site. Don't know about you folks but where I'm from we call that brand of hogwash lyin' and we have small tolerance for it. And even less for them that repeat the hogwash, all the while proudly declaring that they couldn't be bothered with checking their words.

But hey, someone's hustling to whip up snide innuendo and insinuation to craft themselves a big ol' fat falsehood, well I got no problem grabbing that sorry mess of heap o' words by the scruff and draggin' it full on into the public eye, lettin' it be fully disinfected by that there full glare of the public spotlight.

Well, this thread has been um... an interesting read.

I don't know. You bugger off for a day and miss all the fun.

I cannot believe our government is buying this shit.

Same here.

Fortunately the truth, and the scope, is becoming more widely known.

As more people begin to realise that the criticism 'transphobia' is often a silencing tactic, the dots get joined up pretty quickly.

And yes to crushes at school. Years ago, it was such a widely known, and acceptable, phenomenon, it was called a pash. and many girls had them, particularly for older girls. I'm assuming pash was short for passion.

'...may be lesbian...'

@ReluctantCamper

'it's one of the reasons why conflating being trans with being gay is so misleading. what are the physical consequences of being gay?'

Very true. And I believe also a number of girls (females) going through a 'trans phase' may brveothrr lesbian (apparently this word is really not liked so they say gay) or bi or are going through a phase of not being attracted to real boys (as early teenagers who can blame them!) Or being attracted to other girls or anime boys.

Lots of young women have crushes on other girls or women in their teens and twenties (including me) but 'end up' straight. My daughter is a teenager and only one of her friends is described (by dd) as straight.

In terms of sexuality I don't care what my child is, other children are. But sexuality and 'gender' do seem to get conflated.

Of course I would never use the word 'phase' with dd and her friends.

I'm kind of hoping the trend becomes very 'masculine' girls and very 'feminine' boys. Like the 80's Adam Ant!

Just waiting for the next craze, this one has been here too long and has done so much harm. It's got zero to do with actual transsexual people in most cases. Confining on this path will enshrine in law changes that hurt women and children especially girls.

These girls are being co-opted into a very male fantasy.

I cannot believe our government is buying this shit.

twitter.com/LilyLilyMaynard/status/1023041835063750656

Lily Maynard comments:
(extract)
"There’s an ongoing battle between those who recognise Rapid Onset Gender Dysphoria (ROGD) as ‘a thing’ and those who deny it exists. ROGD believers are mostly gender-critical parents and professionals, who have seen it with their own eyes in their children or patients, to them it is undeniable. I am firmly in this camp, having seen ROGD in my own daughter, who is now eighteen and desisted nearly two years ago.

ROGD deniers seem to be mostly transgender people and parents who’ve transitioned their own children. Organisations like Mermaids, Gendered Intelligence and Allsorts are also scathing, because if ROGD exists it challenges the ‘born in the wrong body’ narrative. They claim that parents who observe ROGD in their own children just hadn’t noticed the signs that their child was trans, or that the child had kept it secret from them. Either argument is grounded in the idea of bad or inadequate parenting and assumes a closed and unproductive relationship with the child.

The reality is that many healthcare professionals recognise ROGD as a reality.

Tania Marshall, M.Sc., psychologist, and award winning author accepts the veracity of the condition (left) and therapist and Jungian analyst Lisa Marchiano responds here to a trans-identifed teen who says “recently I have been reading some of your writing on “Rapid Onset Gender Dysphoria…. if my parents knew what ROGD was, they would probably argue that I am in that category. I came out to them about a year ago and I hadn’t shown any gender dysphoria in early childhood.”
In addition, and perhaps most significantly, some clinicians at the Gender Identity Development Service at the Tavistock clinic in London, which deals with gender dysphoric children, recently acknowledged the term. You can read their article in the Journal of Child Psychotherapy here , and the Twitter thread pictured to the left here. " (continues)

lilymaynard.wordpress.com/2018/07/28/rogd-rapid-onset-gender-dysphoria/

But yes...sorry

Ignoring the derail now

Google remembers previous searches and partially bases your results on that, I believe, and therefore I conclude that in addition to anime Icy must really like steak.

lways nice to know there's somebody else on here honest enough to admit they won't engage in simple basic research like, say, reading wikipedia to find out what a site is. But hey, if baseless ad hominem attacks are all you got, perhaps that's why you avoid the research. All those pesky facts, getting in the way and all

Should clarify that i didnt look because im not fussed about anime rather than not wanting to research something that has fuckall to do with the thread

Just wanted to make that clear before you actually have a heartattack

The research was seeing who was 'right' about the search

I think you need to calm down icy

What i saw on the page looked like a load of very pretty pictures if thats any help didnt look any further as im not fussed about anime...not because im worried about what id see

And deviant is just a word....lots of people use words that dont have their original meaning any more

Like wicked or sick

Not sure where i made an attack and i dont have any pearls to clutch and ive made no judgement on the site itself

Its just you seemed to be doubting that it had come up on datun search

But you carry on, i can tell youre a fan

Below is an article from Lily Maynard, via the link from R0wantrees

She asked for examples of ROGD on Twitter. Within the first 48 hours of posting, she had dozens and dozens of replies. I've copied a few below.

This is, beyond doubt, a national scandal. And needs urgent attention.

Although I knew about it, these stories are still shocking, frightening and heartbreaking. I had no idea of the scale.

Tww you are not alone. Thank you for speaking up. The deniers should be ashamed.

"My quirky, non-conforming, socially awkward, very intelligent daughter decided she was a boy after a summer spent on YouTube & Tumblr. Dysphoria followed. This has eased now, and nearly two years later she is a lot happier in her body… Schools need sensible advice on how to help children like my daughter.

My d is a classic case: high IQ, ADHD, anxiety, some ASD symptoms, artist, anime, hard time fitting in w/alpha girls, romanticizes mental illness, romanticizes being LGBT member, trauma, afraid of physical intimacy, etc. Surprise announcement at 15… I forgot to mention this new identity bubbled up after she became completely immersed in and enamored with DeviantArt and Tumblr. Those two sites seem to breed transgender identities.

My daughter came out as trans age 12/13. Outgrew it by age 17. I was encouraged by well meaning people to put her on puberty blockers – which could have caused bone damage & cognitive delays….. It was agonizing. I was so worried about her. And I felt completely alone. Every other parent of a trans child I saw in the media was “so happy” about their child being transgender. No mention of the risks involved, no expression of fear or loss. It was awful.

My daughter qualifies. No dysphoria at puberty at 11. Very feminine after. Decided she was trans around 16 along with an entire friend group. Tumblr, deviantART, YouTube, anime, cosplay, ADHD, anxiety, anorexia, social problems. Currently thinks she’s a gay man.

lilymaynard.wordpress.com/2018/07/28/rogd-rapid-onset-gender-dysphoria/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

The number of girls who think they are gay men. How can this insanity be happening with our government and politicians fannying about with the one issue of self ID.

it's one of the reasons why conflating being trans with being gay is so misleading. what are the physical consequences of being gay?