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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Sexual assaults on Vulnerable Women Prisoners

27 replies

Wanderabout · 18/07/2018 08:52

Reported in the Sun and Mail today.

This makes me really really cross. It was blindingly obvious this was going to happen. Putting a convicted criminal with a penis into a woman's prison is wrong and a complete infringement of their rights.

It doesn't just impact those assaulted. Can you imagine how it must feel to be locked up with someone who is in for violent or sexual crimes, even rape?

This atmosphere where it is'transphobic' to consider, mention or describe the impact of this on females has to stop. It is beyond ridiculous.

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Wanderabout · 18/07/2018 17:29

Thanks Rowantrees, reading that there are clearly lots of people who know what they are talking about and have previously pointed out the obvious problems:

Andrea Albutt, president of the Prison Governors Association said in June 2018: “I have seen women feeling very threatened by transgender prisoners’ presence. Women prisoners are very vulnerable.”

Frances Crook of the Howard League, a prison reform campaign, has said that she is worried that ‘some men with a history of extreme violence and sexual violence against women have found a new way of exercising aggression towards women’.

The British Psychological Society has said this “psychologists working with forensic patients are aware of a number of cases where men convicted of sex crimes have falsely claimed to be transgender females for a number of reasons”

Dr James Barrett of the British Association of Gender Identity Specialists has said this: “It has been rather naïvely suggested that nobody would seek to pretend transsexual status in prison if this were not actually the case. There are, to those of us who actually interview the prisoners, in fact very many reasons why people might pretend this”

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R0wantrees · 18/07/2018 17:14

press release Fairplay for Women:

'Sex attacks: MPs must investigate risks of transgender prisoners'

"MPs on the Commons Justice Committee must investigate the management of transgender prisoners in female prisons after the latest report that a male-born inmate has been accused of sexually assaulting four vulnerable women behind bars, a women’s rights group has said.

The call was made by Fair Play For Women, which has repeatedly revealed disturbing evidence of the dangers posed by some transgender prisoners in the female prison system.

FPFW’s comments follow a report in the Sun saying that “The inmate was sent to a women’s prison despite not having had gender reassignment surgery”. “The first of the alleged attacks took place within days of her arriving at New Hall jail”.

The report is just the latest example of the risks raised by allowing criminals with male bodies to be housed in female prisons with vulnerable women.

FPFW earlier last year revealed that up to half of male-born trans prisoners are likely to be sex offenders or violent criminals.

The group has urged the Justice Select Committee to hold a special hearing on transgender prisoners, as part of its current inquiry on the prison system.

Ministers are currently consulting on a change in the law that would make it much easier for people born male and retaining full male anatomy to be legally recognised as female. Women’s groups say that would erode women’s legal rights to say No to sharing intimate spaces with people who have male bodies.

Nicola Williams said: “The evidence shows that allowing criminals with male bodies to have access to vulnerable women can pose a real threat. Experts have been warning about this for years but no action has been taken and women are suffering fear and abuse. MPs should be asking why the prison system is turning a blind eye to the abuse of women in its care.”

The report in the Sun is just the latest worrying sign about the risks posed by some transgender prisoners.

Senior figures in the criminal justice system have been warning of those dangers for some time and FPFW said MPs can no longer ignore the evidence." (continues)

fairplayforwomen.com/sex-attacks/

Sexual assaults on Vulnerable Women Prisoners
RepeatAfterUs · 18/07/2018 14:23

Yeah I know, as I've heard said on here - women and children shouldn't be collateral damage.
But hey someone's identity is far more important

nauticant · 18/07/2018 12:39

This is terrible - no one seems to care about it until it actually happens

You get that all the time. Trans allies argue for safeguards to be removed, gender critical women say "but what about the increased risk of assaults?", and the reply is "no problem, assaults are illegal, so firstly any assaulter would go to prison, but in any case they'd be deterred by the law".

RepeatAfterUs · 18/07/2018 12:33

This is terrible - no one seems to care about it until it actually happens. It feels like oh it's only women in prison. Who cares what happens to them.
You can comment on FB Sun and DM page. The vast majority of comments are WTF

R0wantrees · 18/07/2018 12:12

but why did they wait until three more assaults before they sent him away?

This is such an important question.

HumphreyCobblers · 18/07/2018 12:07

One of those reports state the transgender prisoner assaulted FOUR TIMES before he was removed from the prison.

Why not after the first one?

of course he shouldn't have been there in the first place, but why did they wait until three more assaults before they sent him away?

bd67th · 18/07/2018 12:04

What is their ultimate solution to this? Force every female below menopause on to birth control? What if that is contraindicative to their health needs?

Birth control methods all have some hazard to the user. Even my amazing frameless IUS has a slight perforation risk during insertion. Rape and sex also run the risk of STI transmission.

My "ultimate solution to this" is to require that either NO MALES EVER are allowed in female prisons, including prison guards because they use their power to rape, or that only post-SRS males (so no penis) are allowed in.
My

R0wantrees · 18/07/2018 12:00

twitter.com/Danvers07943910/status/1019374461471068161

Danvers twitter comment: "Submission made during the process which led to The Miller Report. These professionals who work with offenders were ignored by the Women’s and Equalities committee"

(attachment to tweet shown)

Sexual assaults on Vulnerable Women Prisoners
Wanderabout · 18/07/2018 11:35

It makes you wonder why they're not worrying about the larger portion of non raping transexuals rather than pandering to the sexual abusers.

Indeed

The ideology and mantra implode at points like this. But yet as you all say many just keep repeating it anyway. It writes the women (the prisoners in this case) completely out of the picture.

www.order-order.com/2018/06/11/libdem-policy-transphobic-call-ian-huntley-ian-huntley/amp/

Beardy dude bros like that is one thing. But I just don't understand how normally staunch and empathetic defenders of women's rights and equality like Sarah Champion, Stella Duffy, Stella Creasy, even Penny Mordaunt FFS can't see the dangers and implication of such a powerfully asserted slogan.

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VulvaOfSteel · 18/07/2018 11:10

"Transwomen are Women".

And then "Transwomen are Women". Again. Until you believe it.

The thing is, if they gave in on this, and said, yes, "TWAW but some people might be a bit dodgy and TWAW aren't like those dodgy pedophiles/rapists we're going to let you have a separate prison for them they'd probably do a lot better. As this sort of thing will increase and there will be a backlash.

It makes you wonder why they're not worrying about the larger portion of non raping transexuals rather than pandering to the sexual abusers.

nauticant · 18/07/2018 11:09

It is just so clearly wrong isn't it?

To me it's amazing that some people are so bound to the ideology that they can't allow themselves to see that something in front of their eyes is very wrong.

VulvaOfSteel · 18/07/2018 11:06

"Transwomen are Women".

VulvaOfSteel · 18/07/2018 11:06

What is Stonewall's line on this?

I believe it is "Transwomen are Women".
"Transwomen are Women".
"Transwomen are Women".

Wanderabout · 18/07/2018 11:01

Nic Williams from Fair Play For Women on the radio about this this morning:

mobile.twitter.com/talkRADIO/status/1019496611569860608

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Wanderabout · 18/07/2018 11:00

Thanks Nauticant. It is just so clearly wrong isn't it?

What is Stonewall's line on this?

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OvaHere · 18/07/2018 10:59

So much misinformation bandied about on that thread. People are still buying into wrong body and lady brain.

This is what makes it difficult, it takes concerted effort to start reading and researching beyond the propaganda to see what is really going on.

nauticant · 18/07/2018 10:41

It looks like this is the issue that finally gets a breakthrough on AIBU with nearly all posters saying "WTF!" while the very few trans allies saying TWAW are looking deranged to the rest of the thread.

Accepting self-ID means that TWAW which means it could soon not be possible to keep rapists with penises out of women's prisons. The AIBU thread seems to have a fair few lightbulb moments where posters are now seeing this. And they really don't like it at all.

Wanderabout · 18/07/2018 10:34

The report references risk of harm to the male offender, not the female inmates forced to share accommodation with them.

This sums up everything that is wrong with that report and the state of the worldwide debate on this issue.

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Popchyk · 18/07/2018 09:51

Good article in The Metro actually.

link

"Women and Equalities Committee looked at the issue of transgender prisoners as part of their wider report on Transgender Equality, published in January 2016. The Committee said there was a ‘clear risk of harm’ where trans prisoners are not located in a prison ‘appropriate to their acquired/affirmed gender’.

The report references risk of harm to the male offender, not the female inmates forced to share accommodation with them.

Wanderabout · 18/07/2018 09:49

Thanks all sorry I missed other links!

This just makes me so cross.

How have we got to the point where it is 'transphobic' to even talk about protecting women who have no choice about being locked up with rapists?

And then you have people like Dr Harrop sending malicious email communications to hotels who host meetings for a Labour women led movement to discuss and raise awareness of issues like this.

And God knows who persuading the Quakers we shouldn't be able to meet there to discuss safeguarding implications for women either.

The idea that discussing the impact on women of men saying they are women and changing policy and law to reflect this has GOT to change.

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OvaHere · 18/07/2018 09:42

This is such a violation of human rights. No woman incarcerated should be at risk of becoming pregnant, forcibly or otherwise.

What is their ultimate solution to this? Force every female below menopause on to birth control? What if that is contraindicative to their health needs?

I can't believe this is being done despite the Prison Service making it clear to Maria Miller what a dangerous road this was to tread.

Popchyk · 18/07/2018 09:36

Daily Mail link

Popchyk · 18/07/2018 09:33

Sun link

Transgender lag ‘sexually abused four female prisoners’ days after arriving at West Yorkshire jail

The inmate was sent to a women’s prison despite not having had gender reassignment surgery

BigGreenOlives · 18/07/2018 09:05

I hope that the women are represented by a shit hot lawyer (to quote the divorce threads) and sue the governor/Home Secretary - surely there is a duty of care assumed when you encarcerate people. Those poor women.