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Original poster

What can teachers and other professionals do to create a more gender free environment in our schools?

287 replies

SarahCarer · 11/07/2018 23:11

As my dd is autistic and, as a result, Gender non Conforming (GNC) I thought I would share some thoughts about how to de-gender our schools.

Firstly, teachers need to find a way to address groups of children without saying "girls" or "boys" . This is commonplace in some schools and puts an unnatural focus onto a person's sex which is of no relevance at all in the context.

Secondly every school should have at least one unisex toilet which any pupil can use without special permission.

Thirdly school staff should avoid using the terms "good girl" or "good boy" Again the sex is of no relevance and the statement risks implying that they are being good because they are behaving in a way consistent with femininity or masculinity.

Fourthly ALL sexism and homophobia should be robustly challenged

Fifthly sex ed should not have gendered content

Sixthly there should be no organising of classes with reference to sex except in PE or for sex ed.

Any thoughts on these suggestions or suggestions for others?

These are some of the ways we can protect our autistic children from gender dysphoria (GD)

OP posts:
blackbirdbluebottle · 14/07/2018 21:09

Why not address the children as Pupils or Students. That's what they have always done at my schools and university. Also I cant stand the fact that different genders did different PE stuff. Fair enough a class for girls and a class for boys but why make us do stupid dance lessons when the boys get to do cricket!

noblegiraffe · 14/07/2018 21:07

It’s a behaviour management tool. Boys and girls tend to form friendship groups based on sex. Splitting boys and girls in a seating plan is an easy and quick way of ensuring that friends are not sat next to each other, as when friends are sat next to each other they can spend all lesson socialising.

Seating plans can then be refined once the teacher gets to know the children.

CaptainKirkssparetupee · 14/07/2018 21:06

Then explain how I am gender stereotyping.

You've said, have you not that your daughter does "boy things" not "girl things"? This is her not following stereotypes.

to continue arbitrarily categorizing children according to their sex.

Nobody is currently doing this.
Unless you are referring to gender stereotyping, in which case it's not good.

Calling a group of girls and boys "girls and boys" isn't categorizing children.

Original poster
SarahCarer · 14/07/2018 21:05

Why do you think their sex is relevant in that context?

OP posts:
noblegiraffe · 14/07/2018 21:04

Why do you think a boy girl seating plan is arbitrary categorisation?

Original poster
SarahCarer · 14/07/2018 21:01

Or are you, in fact, just being goady for the fun of it.

OP posts:
Original poster
SarahCarer · 14/07/2018 20:59

Well for a start how about you explain what you mean by gender. Then explain how I am gender stereotyping. Then explain why it is a good thing to continue arbitrarily categorizing children according to their sex.

OP posts:
CaptainKirkssparetupee · 14/07/2018 20:54

In what way?

Original poster
SarahCarer · 14/07/2018 20:54

Care to explain your position fully Captain?

OP posts:
CaptainKirkssparetupee · 14/07/2018 20:53

But what you are asking, in the examples you have given, is for teachers to stop referring to children by there gender (actually their sex but you are sometimes confusing the issue).

CaptainKirkssparetupee · 14/07/2018 20:51

Gender stereotyping in this way is the reason so many children are so lost and confused about what they are.

Original poster
SarahCarer · 14/07/2018 20:50

And sometimes they are called "gender" per one of the options in the dictionary definition linked above.

OP posts:
CaptainKirkssparetupee · 14/07/2018 20:50

Remove gender stereotypes and you won't have do the drastically silly removing of gender.

CaptainKirkssparetupee · 14/07/2018 20:48

I know what you are referring to, but these are called 'stereotypes'.

Original poster
SarahCarer · 14/07/2018 20:46

"Masculinity has nothing to do with gender" We are talking at cross purposes then. I am aware that some people use gender interchangeably with sex. Much more often on these boards it is used to refer to cultural norms and personality traits typically associated with one sex or the other. www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/gender

OP posts:
CaptainKirkssparetupee · 14/07/2018 20:24

Work at removing the stereotypes associated with gender and you will get a better result.
Your daughter is not confirming to stereotypes, that's good.
But it's not being non-gendered.

CaptainKirkssparetupee · 14/07/2018 20:22

so a child who doesn't conform to gender stereotypes doesn't conform to gender.
Do you understand the word "stereotype”

Masculinity has nothing to do with gender

CaptainKirkssparetupee · 14/07/2018 20:20

Can you see the issue? What relevance is their race to this context? And what relevance is their sex?
It's not an issue, race is different as it has different connotations and contex when singling people out by it. However making sure other races are included and represented is done, there's no pretending they don't exist.

Original poster
SarahCarer · 14/07/2018 20:17

Oh and for a radical feminist gender IS gender stereotypes so a child who doesn't conform to gender stereotypes doesn't conform to gender. In my child's case she exclusively chooses clothes and styles labelled for boys but doesn't in other ways conform to masculinity

OP posts:
CaptainKirkssparetupee · 14/07/2018 20:15

Walk before you can run springs to mind.

noblegiraffe · 14/07/2018 20:14

It is arbitrary categorisation and segregation with no value

Why do you think a teacher might sit a class boy girl boy girl?

If your DD accepts female pronouns, recognises that her sex is female, then why on earth would she object to being referred to as a girl?

Original poster
SarahCarer · 14/07/2018 20:13

"And you have heard teachers address only one gender have you?" Erm if you mean sex then yes - quite a few teachers on this thread have said that they do so regularly and yes I have seen that but I don't think you're understanding me. I'm not complaining that teachers are addressing only one sex. Try it this way. "Now then black children and white children open your book at page 13". Can you see the issue? What relevance is their race to this context? And what relevance is their sex? The constant categorisation reinforces the fact that society sees children as male or female first before any other part of their experience, personality or physical make-up. I know my suggestion is a radical one and I am not about to start policing people's language. It is entirely your choice and your prerogative whether to attempt to de-gender your language. I am only suggesting it would be a helpful thing for all children. I absolutely agree with others however that there is action needed in addition and these suggestions are not as critical as challenging active stereotyping. That should go without saying.

OP posts:
CaptainKirkssparetupee · 14/07/2018 19:59

If we take away the sterotypes, which is what most people want, there is no need to stupidly remove gender and pretend it doesn't exist.

CaptainKirkssparetupee · 14/07/2018 19:58

You also do not speak for the whole of the autistic community, this has little to do with autism.

CaptainKirkssparetupee · 14/07/2018 19:57

right black children let's have your attention now

And you have heard teachers address only one gender have you?