Misgendering - How do biological women handle it?

And when I said I'd been mistaken for a boy as a teenager, and even went out specifically as a boy at uni and was convincingly taken for one, I was told I was making it up because it never happens

There is a difference between just walking around, registering someone's sex on a subconscious level we are barely aware of and which doesn't matter to being face to face with someone in a space intended to be for only one sex. Where you are potentially vulnerable, I think women are by and large, apt to make instinctive evaluations about someone's sex, for good reason.
As a teacher, I was routinely called 'sir'. I never bothered to correct. I believe there are older people who go around deliberately misgendering babies in prams, despite whatever gender-confirming outfit they are wearing and I fully intend to do this also on retirement. My daughter was frequently called 'the lad' and 'he' when she had short hair. Once this happened at the local dump and she thought it was ironic because the man who said it had a very long ponytail.

using gentlemen for example because predominantly men in the room and can't be bothered to adapt for women present

That was so standard I found it more jarring to have my Christian name occasionally tacked on - as I was only woman in the room.

I was misgendered in public once - waiting for a train - I got vague impression is was supposed to be some kind of comment on my desirability - I have wide hips, large breasts and shoulder length hair - can't remember what I was wearing. I ignored it and moved away from the men. I wasn't upset as such just wary about their behavior.

One of my young children did it to a neighbour – she’d been ill for a while cut her hair and put on a lot weight and TBH unless close up it was hard to tell especially when she was dressed in jeans and oversized t-shirt – it clearly upset up her and I corrected my child and apologised and she waved it off. I felt terrible she’d been upset but she was polite and understanding.

I'll try again since my first comment is seemingly verboten. I have been misgendered several times in my lifetime. It happens even more now I shave my head. I couldn't care less.

Yes ive had all of your examples

Ive been called sir in restaurants and one particularly memorable time was called a man...by my dad!!

And when i was walking into loo someone told me i couldn't go in as it was the ladies

I am taller than average, my clothes although from the ladies department aren't usually feminine and i have very very short hair...love my makeup and have a very matronly figure

Once they hear me or see my face they apologise

I don't usually do anything as i dont care...but i was incensed the other day when looking for a bill for my DBS, the first few i found had used my husbands initial...so fucking useless

You must have been a very delicate teenager to have had your confidence knocked by that.

Um, I don't know, I don't think I was. But I was awkward and out of place, and felt scrutinised and judged. I was worried how frequently people might be thinking I was a boy and my not know about it, like that everyone would be looking at me when I went into loos and stuff, thinking I didn't belong there. I think those are fairly common teenaged frailties, aren't they?

The stuff at uni was years later; I lived with a bunch of boys and for a laugh me and the other girl in our house would dress up in their clothes, wear sports bras and beanies, give ourselves 6 o'clock shadows and all hit the town. I was fairly confident in myself by that point; it was a good number of years after the first incident. I was asked if I was gay (i.e. a gay man) quite frequently; couldn't help giving boys the eye I guess.

I tend to just laugh at it. Mind I used to get irrationally angry when people seemed to assume my daughter was male if not in pink and frills. Seemed male was the default.

Some teenagers are delicate, Juells, isn't that the whole point of delaying any physical trans treatment until adulthood?

To be fair I was pretty shaken when it happened to me as a teenager and it really knocked my confidence for a while.

even went out specifically as a boy at uni and was convincingly taken for one

Does. Not. Compute.

You must have been a very delicate teenager to have had your confidence knocked by that. I was frequently mistaken for a boy when I was a teenager because I'd cut my own hair very short with a razor, and wore leather. I found it amusing.

When I had short hair and dressed androgynously in the 80s and 90s, I was never misgendered. Was I criticised, judged, mocked, and shamed? Sometimes. Did I receive misogynistic, homophobic abuse? Yes, sometimes, including some notable, life-changing instances. But everyone knew I was female.

(By the way, when I just wrote misgendered up there, it was autocorrected to 'cisgendered.' I've fixed it, but it's still underlined in red as a misspelling. Fuck off!)

But for the last 2 - 3 years, with short hair again after an interlude of nearly 2 decades, I've been misgendered a lot. Thanks for starting this thread, I've wanted to discuss this phenomenon.

The basic structure of my face hasn't changed (despite my decrepitude). My friends say it is feminine (I've asked). I'm not 'pretty' but I'm considered fairly attractive. I still wear the same type of clothing (the fashion world would call it 'gentlewoman' or 'menswear-inspired'). My body is small and clearly female. I have medium-sized tits, no Adam's apple, and while I'm not an hourglass type, my figure is curvy enough to read XX immediately from all angles.

I have discovered that unless I'm wearing accessories and makeup - things traditionally associated with femininity - I am now being confused with a trans man with significant frequency. The shape of my haircut has a lot to do with it. It can't be too traditionally masculine (square shaped) or the misgendering is more likely to happen. People, in an attempt to be polite, are calling me "Mr" or "Sir" in situations where such titles are used. Receptionists, shop clerks etc. Usually it makes me (and my children) laugh heartily. But sometimes I find it upsetting - for example when I was in hospital, without any accoutrements of socially constructed gender. Because obviously, anyone who chooses the NHS pyjamas over the NHS nightie (garment of horror), has short hair and a bare face, and is regularly visited by a woman must be a trans man. Despite female listed as sex on the records, despite female name. I had already realised most of the staff assumed I was a lesbian (I'm actually married to a man, but he wasn't around much). That didn't bother or surprise me. People often assume I'm a lesbian, always have, and in fact I'm bisexual. But then I discovered that at least one nurse thought I was a trans man. That was both funny and gutting and I'm still both amused and upset when I think about it, personally and socio-politically. I know they knew I'm female. But because (I'm guessing) of widespread acceptance of self-ID (as a concept, not a legal construct), they didn't want to upset me by assuming I "identified" as a woman. They thought they were doing the right thing. But they had never asked - and to be honest, in my fragile state it just made me feel horrible, unfeminine, ugly and worried about living in a society where moderately gender non-conforming women like me are now assumed to be identifying and presenting as men. I always wanted to expand what it looks like and is like to be female. But it seems as if the opposite is happening. At least to me and my children.

They are several years apart and have haircuts that some consider to be gender non-conforming. When the oldest was little, people mis-sexed them often. No big deal. Now the youngest, with the same haircut, has been assumed to be a trans child on 2 occasions.

On one of these, I was praised for letting them be their true self. The commenter was embarrassed when I clarified things. On the other, the commenter made her gender-critical position clear (which was a bit rude, in a public place, even though I agree).

yes when I was a child...

I cant say as how it kept me awake at night.

This came up on a trans thread I was posting on too, and I got roundly told it never happens because people can tell the difference between the sexes, like, all the time. And when I said I'd been mistaken for a boy as a teenager, and even went out specifically as a boy at uni and was convincingly taken for one, I was told I was making it up because it never happens

To be fair I was pretty shaken when it happened to me as a teenager and it really knocked my confidence for a while.

I raised this point in a trans thread and was told "that's a different thing".
I can't recall having being misgendered, despite having very short hair on and off (it's currently shorter than DH's shaggy mop).
When I met DH though, he had long hair and was misgendered a lot, by men, women and children, despite being over 6ft.
With children it's different because pre-puberty, their facial features are pretty similar. DS had longer hair and he was getting misgendered several times every day, and obviously girls with shorter hair are boys .
In summary, DH and DS have been literally killed, myself and DD are lucky enough not to have been

Happened a lot before I had my kids. I would feel a bit insulted when I was a teenager and desperate to be found pretty, but would laugh it off.
Post kids with large boobs, rarely happens. Do hate it when doing things like looking for a new car and the salesman will only talk to DH whilst looking at my boobs. Plenty salesmen lost a sale from me that way.
And letters sent to me as a sir annoys me, not that I get get called sir or mister but the assumption that it is always the men handling all the administration stuff. Really gets on my nerves.

This happened lots when I was young. I was a short-haired child dressed in hand-me downs from my male cousins, I spent most of my childhood being described as a boy. The only time this upset me was when Father Christmas got it wrong when I visited him at a school event - I think because I thought he should really know better, being FC and everything.

Doesn't happen now, I think as I have long hair. I do wear "mens" clothes quite a lot as many "ladies" clothes don't fit me.

Happened to my husband when he was a young chap with long hair - he was told he was going in the wrong toilets, and chatted up by some dodgy drunk bloke in the pub who thought we were two women out together and clearly in need of his company.

Could we have a link please, Lass?

Men’s clothes = clothes purchased from the men’s section, sold in men’s sizes.

I suppose they aren’t men’s once they belong to me, but most of them are offcasts from my 18 year old son or my husband.

You can call them ‘gender neutral’ if you like, it it’s not a term I personally like to use. I prefer ‘unisex’ but in this particular example I literally meant what I said. Clothes made for men, marketed at men, previously belonging to men.

*To be honest, when a gender critical poster writes about mens' clothes or hairstyles I just assume they haven't bothered to add the inverted commas, knowing that most readers won't wilfully misinterpret their meaning.

I don't think "Gotcha*!

Likewise.

Really? Baracker. I got several very nasty comments on a thread when I said I don't wear masculine /men' sclothing ."Whatever could I mean? "

It seems saying "I wear men's clothes" is g
fine and laudable, what a great gender critical feminist that makes you but saying "I don't wear men's clothes" gets you treated like an idiot.

So actually it is "gotcha" There is a great deal of hypocrisy on this board.

I am with RuPaul on this: "You can call me he. You can call me she. You can call me Regis & Cathy Lee; I don't care! Just as long as you call me."

What do you mean by "men's clothes"?

I assumed the poster meant 'garments-marketed-towards-the-male-sex-which-can-in-reality-be-worn-by-either-sex-and-yet-which-are-distinguishable-from-garments-marketed-towards-the-female-sex-by-virtue-of-pattern-design-features-and-merchandising'

Trousers are 'gender neutral', and have been for over a century. But it doesn't take a forensic scientist to distinguish between trousers intentionally marketed towards women and trousers marketed towards men. Designers do have a tendency to signpost who the trousers are 'supposed to be for' using cues like cut, colour, pattern, pockets, buttons, etc.

Noting that a garment has been 'gendered' through features and merchandising and rejecting that implied gender rule by wearing it as a member of the opposite sex is consistent with being gender critical.

To be honest, when a gender critical poster writes about mens' clothes or hairstyles I just assume they haven't bothered to add the inverted commas, knowing that most readers won't wilfully misinterpret their meaning.

I don't think "Gotcha!"

I've been misgendered a lot over the years.

When I was a teenager (in the 80s) I was often mistaken for a young adolescent male.

In work, via email, as my email didn't show my first name. Also quite often by foreigners who even if my name is written down often seem to perceive it as a male name.

Occasionally misgendered in person by foreigners, usually people who's first language doesn't have gendered pronouns.

Pretty permanently online, Mumsnet is really the only online mainstream space where there is an assumption that a poster is female.

It's never been intended to be offensive so I have never been bothered. Sometimes I would correct in a work environment or when I was heading into a single-sexed environment eg toilet. Interestingly I only ever got the "wrong lav, love" on my way in, never when I was in the room.

These days it only happens rarely in person, the occasional duff mailshot letter and when I get people ringing to check my washing machine/computer virus check.

I'm also misgendered when online gaming and I have learned not to be "out" as female. It's almost the only time I 've been maliciously "correctly gendered" - called female as an insult because they think I am male.

I don't need to deal with it because generally it doesn't bother me. The "dear sir" type of stuff irritates me but doesn't cause me any personal distress.

It doesn’t happen to me in person these days. It did occasionally when I was younger with short hair and dressing in a way to hide my shape. I don’t recall it bothering me but then I didn’t want people to notice my body at all.

It has happened a lot online, especially in the earlier days of the Internet when more spaces were primarily male. A fair few people told me that I ‘sounded’ male because of the way I wrote or the things I wrote about. Found this a fairly sexist presumption, but it didn’t upset me, I used to laugh at it.

Lass, I mean clothes I purchased from the menswear section.