Are we the baddies?

How does Nick Matte think babies get made?

Ooh fun-I did university research too! Though ours was funded by the ESRC. Can't remember the exact figure but it was around 1.25 million. Now, admittedly, we focused more on obtaining and disseminating results than awards, but we did pick up a few shiny objects. Can I ask what the impact factor of the journals you were published in were? Did this improve your department REF?

Thanks for waking me up Nick Matte. I now understand that there's no such thing as biological sex... to dare to say out loud that there are such things as human females and human males is to be a cisnormative-heteronormative-patriarchal-imperialist-bigot... well fuck me... guess I need to retake A level human biology because it seems my current qualification is now out of date if in 2018 all you need to create new human life is two human bodies that have differing (not sure of the degrees of difference required because I don't have an MSc in Gender Studies) internal gender identities*...

*You know that feeling that permeates every single cell of your physical body and doesn't stop reminding you that at your innermost core you have a) a pink, irrational ladybrain that seeks out heels, makeup, fashion, hair trends and submissive roles. b) a blue, logical, courageous, stable, male brain. c) a non-binary spirit d)... z)... a1)... z∞)...

Apologies! Thought it was Stephen Whittle

Nick Matte

It's awful. Whittle is behind vast amounts of 'under the radar' change. At the time this was recorded *he was actively working behind the scenes on UN and EU policy, I believe.

smile15 the statement you made about gay men being considered paedophiles is wrong through and through.

You are conflating two points.

The first is that the age of consent for homosexual male sex used to be 21, whilst it was 16 (or 18?) for heterosexual sex. Gay men rightly campaigned to remove the discrepancy.

However, there was also another group who argued that the age of consent should be removed completely (Paedophile Information Exchange among other). The latter co-opted the legitimacy of the main arguments and were rightly called out on this and under-age sex is deplored and a crime.

But neither of these things mean people thought the gay male population were paedophiles!

garam, did you read barracks post on the increase in traffic coming through the feminism board?

How do you reach the conclusion that they are here because they don’t like what’s being said? I mean sure, some of that population will be hate-reading, but they can’t all be so shy they can’t bear to post, ever.

Likewise, I can’t definitively conclude that they’re all supportive. Neither of us know- but it’s a weird proposition that those not posting have a different composition to those posting. Why would they? If anything, the evidence suggests the opposite to what you’re saying: There’s a constant stream of posters delurking to say they find the arguments convincing, and far fewer who delurk to take exception.

Lance "actual university funded research in gender studies just says to me that you would be the last person likely to admit that gender is bollocks, really."

Indeed. Follow the money...

I agree SomeDyke. My thought process on reading those credentials was:

"I am more educated than most
Really? Why do you think that?
having done actual university
Which university? Cambridge? Something online and unaccredited?
funded
Who funded it and why?
research
what research? Which parameters, conclusions? Was it peer reviewed? By whom?
In gender studies
What's that? Why should I take this field more seriously than biological sciences?
that has won awards"
Which awards? Are we talking Nobel Prize or certificate from your university?

Garam my point was exactly that It's ridiculous to suggest that 12 million MN users have the same opinion on trans issues.

Lol goddess

I personally wouldn’t consider you feminists

I self identify as a feminist. So how can you tell me I'm not?

82% of voters are opposed to Self ID.

Active posters on this board may well be relatively few in number but our opinion on self ID isn’t unusual out in the real world.

We’ve far more in common with the other 12 millions Mumsnetters than you imagine.

Arf! keep your hair on, whatever your name is now. Don’t insult us twice by pretending you didn’t mean the first one. You wouldn’t be the first person to rock up believing that they were considerably more educated than a bunch of mummies. If you don’t think that, then fine.

somedyke

"The problem with MumsNet users and their views on people who are transgender

All 12 million of them? That's a rather large generalisation.

I am more educated than most having done actual university funded research in gender studies that has won awards rather than the super egotistical google you're all capable of"

This is the thing, there are not 12 million gender critical mumsnet users.
Any that are not gender critical mostly get hounded off the feminism boards.

These feminism boards are dominated by a couple of hundred people at best. Whatever the stats are traffic etc, the same dozen or so voices constantly set the narrative.

It's a teensy tiny percentage of the '12 million mumsnet users' that believe this anti-trans-framed-as-womens-rights-nonsense.

I would love someone to break down the most toxic anti-trans threads, and see who shepherds the narrative, it would be no surprise to anyone who has read more than a dozen threads exactly how few names constantly come up again and again setting the tone.