Posters jumping before they're pushed

All these people who see no problem with burly men in women's toilets, changing rooms, prisons, wards and refuges

IN RL a lot of people assume it means a third space - male, female and mixed or the idea is so bats shit out there it won’t ever happen.

I was fine with changing villages at swimming pools - it's much better for me taking all the DC swimming right until I went to a slight further out pool with an absolutely terrible set of changing village style cubicles - huge gaps around base, top and sides - My DD1 12 and DS 11 weren't comfortable changing only happy as fairly quiet got stall next to one another and I was on hand.

I notice many women and few men not using empty cubicles but getting changed in the loos off the village.

I think there an assumption of well-designed or well managed areas when reality is going to be more Barbican style faculties where they stuck gendered neutral signs up meaning women loos were even busier means even longer queues then management acting surprised when people are upset at encountering entirely predictable problems.

Saw same the mixed sex loos in nightclub in nearby Bristol – the surprised a man would take opportunity to follow a woman into loos break down door to sexually assault. Seem to be same with all safe guarding TBH -on this issue – oh that’s just scaremongering – something happens oh were so shocked and surprised that happened

Damnthatonestakentryanother2

Being female not a choice.
Being a bullying man is.
So if you really find being a bully so stressful, there's a really simple solution...
... Just stop!
That's all you have to do!
Stop the hatred. Stop the lies. Stop the abuse.
Easy. And if you want to be an activist about something, be an activist about something useful -- campaign against FGM, or in favour of better education for girls, or support for the victims of domestic violence, or to stay in the EU, almost anything that doesn't involve dismantling women's rights just for your amusement.
You will feel much better for it.

Gosh, I do get the disappointment, really I do. These New Rules are at best subjective, at worse draconian, and pretty much hostile to the (regular) users at FWR.

I think it clear that actual feminism is no longer welcome on the board/site. It has happened a number of times in the past, and I cannot see that it is recoverable from its current position. Ironic that the tide is turning on the T-Borg.

For MN, they won't feel the full implication of their decision for a while to come, not until the Breast Feeding forum gets 'rebranded' Chest Feeding, and all sorts of other nonsense. Then, most of those (ordinary, non-feminist) users will Peak Trans. Then it will be too late for the site. Actual women will leave in droves. Then and only then, will MN realise what a mistake they have made. Sure, it may take a year or two, but gradually, site hits will decline, and so will revenue. So be it.

Totally I agree. Go to The Other Place. Re-group. And come back stronger to a new, public forum after that.

I love it when people against feminism give me a to do list.

I think we are all bored of you now damn. It's the upside down logic. Gets old really quickly.

"blatant law-breaking"

?

I very much hope people don't fully leave here however as I think it's unbelievably important to keep things going here for new lurkers and visitors.

I get the new rules are pants and why people want to talk elsewhere; I would like to say that due to outspokenness here my perceptions have been challenged and ideas changed - of hope that while jumping through lexical hoops that This would continue here.

Hi, I can't post much at the mo as I have a newborn and 5 year old (will be less in the summer!) but would like to keep in touch with the conversations.

This board has meant so much to me and had helped me to become a rad fem and see sexism so clearly across many areas of life. Two boys now so I'd like to keep up with things.

Could someone please pm me where you're all going (me we?) or a fb group etc. I've been on mn since 2011 under other names, on this board under several names (when I was more scared) and this one.

Could I please have a link to the other place? I'm a frequent namechanger, but happy to provide twitter handle or something to a regular.

Great question Pacers. All these people who see no problem with burly men in women's toilets, changing rooms, prisons, wards and refuges...just HOW do you manage to be so relaxed? HOW do you come to the conclusion that all will be fine and no woman or girl will be unsafe, ever?

Particularly after #metoo. And no, the fact that certain evil men will do it anyway isn't good enough. Because strip away social convention and sex segregated spaces and they'll do it even more.

twitter.com/fairplaywomen/status/1010959564701880321

Also some of those threads about boys in changing rooms are ridiculous. "My son is 13 but I don't feel like he does a good job of washing his hair by himself, why are all you other women being so misandrist? Why can't I bring him in with me? He's only little!"

I've had experience of this real life too. It's as if sex segregation is a privilege not a right. People act as if any space is for the use of males as they see fit. If the allow us sex segregation, we can have it, but they retain the right to withdraw it at anytime.

Hi, can someone please pm me with the link to the private group please? I have been a member her since pretty much day 1 under various accounts and usernames but would like to explore different platform for discussing my concerns as it doesn't seem as if this is a safe place to do so anymore.

Many thanks x

Also some of those threads about boys in changing rooms are ridiculous. "My son is 13 but I don't feel like he does a good job of washing his hair by himself, why are all you other women being so misandrist? Why can't I bring him in with me? He's only little!"

fairplayforwomen.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/EA2010_womensrights_-factsheet.pdf

Not going to mention the shop. They would be fired. How bad is that.

Had a great chat with two shop assistants the other day. Mentioned about the Markies change rooms allowing men in and they were shocked. 'That's so wrong because men is men and women are women' one said. Frankly I don't know why we need these long threads because that says it all.

To demonstrate how ingrained the preference for single sex changing areas is, my bestie is completely nonchalant about sharing an open pool at the hot springs with men (she's Japanese and grew up with it), but appalled by the idea of having to share the changing room in which everyone strips off and showers before going into the pool itself with them. Says that having someone potentially watch you shower is far more intimate and therefore violating if you'd rather they not do so, and also immediately raised "this is an enclosed space in which someone could trap you" concerns. So even if you normalize the idea that men and women will be naked together in some public spaces women still expect other spaces to be sex segregated and stay that way.

(I think most men do too actually, it's just that for them it's about privacy only and not fear, and also they aren't as used to having to defend their spaces, which is why ManFriday is proving so effective.)

Have you seen how the "can I take my 10yr old boy into the women's changing area" type threads go on AIBU? People dont want mixed sex facilities.
I think part of the problem is people have no idea what is going on & the the other part is they think it means no longer functioning male bodies going into the women's changing room. We need to get the stonewall umbrella out there.

Great question Pacers. All these people who see no problem with burly men in women's toilets, changing rooms, prisons, wards and refuges...just HOW do you manage to be so relaxed? HOW do you come to the conclusion that all will be fine and no woman or girl will be unsafe, ever?

Nobody I've spoken to about unisex facilities thinks it's a good idea other than the one very keen young activisty type who thinks it would be great for the genderfluid/agender contingent (apparently everyone else being uncomfortable isn't a problem because they'll still be less uncomfortable than the genderfluid/agender person would be when forced to pick a space).