Ministers commit to preserving sex-based exemptions

It's an interesting insight into how the other side thinks though, this insistence that we ought to be willing to let say Debbie into spaces in which we'll be naked. Like that's a reward for political support, or ought to be.

Indeed. Debbie is helping women campaign for our single-sex spaces to be retained.

That people think we should show our gratitude for that by saying Debbie should be able to access all women-only spaces is a bit bizarre.

PersonWithAVulva
How is it too difficult? And its means tested also.
It's not difficult if you live in the same place for several years and keep good records. I do, and my application went through with no problems.
But the Gender Recognition Panel has a reputation for being very picky about the evidence it requires, and its instructions are far from explicit — they appear to be clear enough, but there are a number of hidden hoops that you don't see until an application has been rejected.
For someone who has moved several times, or has not kept every utility bill and bank statement since their GRS, it can be more difficult — especially as they won't always accept print-outs of electronic invoices.
There are countless hurdles to trip people. And every time an application is rejected it costs another £140 to re-submit.

Yes, the £140 is means tested... but the ancillary costs — such as solicitors fees, and fees for getting a copy of a decree absolute are not.

I use sex dysphoria, as transsexual people are dysphoric about their sexed body. Not their 'gender' which is nothing but a bunch of stereotypes.
The term is gender dysphoria — whether you or I agree with it or not! I see your concern about "gender" but I think that is because you are reading it as gender role (which is, as you say, "a bunch of stereotypes") rather than gender identity (which is an internal sense of "self" )

We WANT the EA amended. We want sex specific spaces to be a right, not 'permissible'.

There is no way this is not the work of TRA. As in look over there while this nice consultation gets under way.

Damned that report compiled by a government minister has been shared so many times that I can’t be arsed to share it again. Not all government intentions are by way of draft legislation.

LangCleg
I thought you got banned, Damned?
Not yet, despite your efforts to curtail my freedom of speech. But when it happens, I will follow the example set by Germaine Greer, Miranda Yardley and loads of others, and go screaming to all the mainstream media about how I got no-platformed, gagged and banned for expressing my opinion.

PersonWithAVulva
Ah yes, never can bring yourself to say 'pro women'..it has to be anti-trans, which is not even true.
I have seen nothing in any of these anti-trans threads that is "pro women": it is 100% unadulterated pure anti trans. Show me anything — literally anything — in a trans related thread that will do anything to make women's lives better?
If you really wanted to make life better for millions of ordinary women, you would do it by not stirring up false fears about something that is nothing whatsoever to do with them.

The comments show people support us though and I suspect future law changes won't be pushed through with no media debate.

PeakPants
Well, apart from that is what the government has previously said they would do in terms of amending the Act.
Link to draft Bill, please?

MillyTheKid
So you want people like Debbie Hayton kept out too?
What makes you think Debbie has a GRC?
The overwhelming majority of TSs don't.

PermissionToSpeakSir
Mmmm they will launch the consultation to co-incide with Pride (not IWD eh?) - what a great day to create a bias in your responses govt!
Which Pride is that? — there are lots of them, all over the country indifferent days.
More to the point, is that they have delayed launching it until Parliament is in recess, and the silly season is upon us, when the papers will have plenty of space available for their usual anti-trans propaganda.

This isn't us winning. This is a change in PR strategy.

As soon as Self ID is piggybacked in on the back of this empty promise, the EA will be ferociously targeted.

i suspect this is on the advice of transadvocates who will see this as a temporary loss leader for Self ID. They saw the lie of the land with ManFriday and have changed tack.

Arse about tit if you ask me

Agree, they should have said "sex segregated spaces should remain that - people who identify as opposite to their birth sex admitted on a case by case basis."

It's an interesting insight into how the other side thinks though, this insistence that we ought to be willing to let say Debbie into spaces in which we'll be naked. Like that's a reward for political support, or ought to be.

^ This. It doesn't matter which side of the fence people who present as opposite to their birth sex are on during this. We want sex segregated spaces and not human made sex's but birth sex.

I have no problem with sharing space with transwomen who have had genital surgery. The problem with self ID and GRCs being given without genital surgery is that they are being swamped by men identifying as women without this.

It reads pretty meaninglessness to me. Just trying to pacify women and shut them up
Instead of the assumption that spaces will be single sex they have to justify why trans women cannot access those spaces. The default seems to be trans women can access spaces for women
Arse about tit if you ask me

It's an interesting insight into how the other side thinks though, this insistence that we ought to be willing to let say Debbie into spaces in which we'll be naked. Like that's a reward for political support, or ought to be.

Surely the fact that such spaces are sex segregated in the first place, and the reasons for that..means any space that is sex segregated is 'a proportionate means of meeting a legitimate aim'?

Absolutely!

So you want people like Debbie Hayton kept out too?

Fgs YES. God, would you ever question me if I said I didn't want to get changed with males and say 'what, you want to keep people like your dad and your brother and your male friends out?'. It makes no difference whether they are friends or I like them or what, it is about privacy and dignity.

Trans people need their own spaces.

not to change a law nobody was proposing changing...

It is not true that "nobody was proposing changing" the EA as it regulates single sex exemptions. See
publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201516/cmselect/cmwomeq/390/390.pdf

Paragraph 132 on page 34:

We recommend that the Equality Act be amended so that the occupational requirements provision and / or the single-sex / separate services provision shall not apply in relation to discrimination against a person whose acquired gender has been recognised under the Gender Recognition Act 2004.

I think we have made huge strides forward recently. Only a few months ago no one in the media would discuss the trans issue at all and it was all bogged down in "no debate" and the general public thought all transwomen had had genital surgery.

The Scottish issue of the Times has a variant on this article because in Scotland the government has given schools guidance saying children as young as 4 can change gender in school without their parents being informed! A Christian Institute is challenging this. The article goes on to mention Man Friday and the woman with a fear of men being in a locked ward with a 6 foot transgender patient.
The article ends with a Scottish gov spokesperson talking about supporting trans people and Scotland being progressive re LGBT issues but does show that this has implications for non trans people unlike gay rights.

In a major victory, ministers have vowed not to change a law nobody was proposing changing...

Perhaps parliament wasn’t considering changing it but it’s incredibly disingenuous to suggest that nobody was proposing changing it. There are posters here that would like it changed. See attached screen shot.

So it is actually a victory, and it is heartening to see that the government does not agree that transwomen are women.

I thought you got banned, Damned?