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Original poster

Lurker Delurking to seek support

38 replies

KaiserThiefs · 19/06/2018 10:04

Loong time reader of this board but I've never really posted because of all the other eloquent posters that say it all so much better than me.

I just wanted to let you know that what you're doing matters, it really matters to me and all the others like me and I also wanted a little hand hold because my son's school have sent home a letter about an upcoming residential trip where they've stated that:

'there will be no mixed genders in any room'

I've written to them [wibble] to get clarification if the accommodation will be sex segregated as this is a provision that's protected in the Equality Act.

I want you all to know that your voices give our actions strength and let us know that it's not bigotry to ask for adequate safeguarding.

It's not phobic to protect our children's dignity and it's okay to say no because it makes me feel uncomfortable.

There doesn't need to be a better reason, our rights are protected and it's not an act of hate to want to protect them.

(if they write back and challenge me though I know I'm going to apologise and run away, I have been socialised to the nth degree!)

OP posts:
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StroppyWoman · 19/06/2018 17:14

As a recently "uncloaked" lurker myself, Good on you, KaiserThiefs!

BettyDuMonde · 19/06/2018 15:02

Well done!

You may as well stick around now.

TimeLady · 19/06/2018 14:53

If we all start to ask politely for clarification whenever we see an opportunity like this one, we can en masse raise awareness and make a difference. It doesn't have to be confrontational as the OP has shown, but it will have made others stop and think. Well done.

speakingwoman · 19/06/2018 14:32

well done.

PositivelyPERF · 19/06/2018 13:08

That’s fantastic KaiserThiefs. You have also given them something to think about. It’s probably a good time to send a thankyou note, for clarifying their meaning, along with a transgender trend pack.

loveyouradvice · 19/06/2018 12:40

Kaiser congratulations! Really great....

Looking forward to hearing more from you now you have delurked!

Datun · 19/06/2018 12:06

Well done KaiserThiefs.

And this is how it starts. Most people are fully comprehending of the reason why we separate the sexes.

And the first rule is to understand that it means sex, not gender.

Once that is firmly inprinted in people's heads, the rest is easier to talk about and deconstruct.

Socialisation is a weird thing. Even talking about it (hello,again, to how words and language are vital for increased understanding) reduces the impact.

Because you find yourself doublechecking your reaction to more and more things.

"Have I said yes to that because I mean it, or because I'm worried it will displease someone if I say no?"

The answers can be eye-opening.

And for what it's worth, I think you have grasped the issues here perfectly. Welcome.

spontaneousgiventime · 19/06/2018 11:51

Note to self: Read the full thread before relying.

spontaneousgiventime · 19/06/2018 11:49

Well done OP and if they reply you are not going to crumble, you are Spartacus!

Come back and update us and we will help you with a reply to tie them in knots. Your child deserves sex segregated spaces and that's why you're doing this.

Proud of you!

Norther · 19/06/2018 11:41

Well done KaiserThiefs and great story ElleToro. That is so hopeful. So glad I contributed to TransgenderTrend fundraiser. Will definitely include booklet with my letter. Going to check my bank to see if I can donate again!!

Theinconstantgardener · 19/06/2018 11:40

well done Kaiser

AngryAttackKittens · 19/06/2018 11:32

Good job!

MsBeee · 19/06/2018 11:06

Well done!! I too am socialised to to rock the boat. What a great thing you have done!!
Holding 🤚 🤚

UpstartCrow · 19/06/2018 11:06

That's a good result. You;re only one person but hopefully you've just made them think a bit about how they word their policies and letters home.
(hiss)

Original poster
KaiserThiefs · 19/06/2018 10:55

Ha ha! [backs away carefully]

Thanks BarrackerBarmer it's been a long time coming

OP posts:
BarrackerBarmer · 19/06/2018 10:49

Be ye not fooled.

Vipers we are, and vipers we remain.

Welcome to the nest.

R0wantrees · 19/06/2018 10:47

Its good when its correct.

As sex is acknowledged as a protected characteristic in the policy, it should be easier for the school to understand and acknowledge the basis of your query.

As you say, sometimes people use gender as a euphemism for sex.

It may be in this case that's what has happened.

It should be easy for the school to confirm.

Original poster
KaiserThiefs · 19/06/2018 10:47

Noo, OldCrone didn't take it that way for a second and I appreciate the reassurance :)

OP posts:
Original poster
KaiserThiefs · 19/06/2018 10:46

Ooh:

"The boys field is to the right and they have toilets next to them and the girls field is to the left and they use the toilets in the house during the night. So yes, the tents are single sexed."

Result. It's single sexed but most importantly they've had to clarify the point so hopefully they'll choose to be less ambiguous in future (or I'll write in again)

So far, delurking has been a very pleasant experience. Nest of Vipers, my arse.

OP posts:
OldCrone · 19/06/2018 10:44

I'm with you all the way, KaiserThiefs. I was just trying to offer some reassurance that whatever the school means, it probably won't affect your son directly at this moment. I was not for a moment suggesting you shouldn't have said anything. Sorry if my meaning was not clear.

Original poster
KaiserThiefs · 19/06/2018 10:43

Strangely enough I did have a look at that too R0wantrees and it was written with Stonewall so I thought 'Oh no, it's going to be a pile or progressive bullshit' but I was wrong!

Sex mentioned as a protected characteristic and no dogma present at all! I do wonder if it'll remain the same though, it was last updated about 4 years ago so I suppose it means pushing back like this is important to make sure the policies stay that way.

OP posts:
Original poster
KaiserThiefs · 19/06/2018 10:39

Absolutely agree OldCrone and Ekphrasis and I realise that this doesn't really affect my son but it's when groups can turn around and highlight how accepting of self ID vast swathes of the country are because of badly thought out inclusive documents and policies like this that I start to worry.

We're too conditioned to not make a fuss if it doesn't harm us directly and then we're told off for making a fuss when it finally does affect us. We fought for sex segregation for a good reason, I don't want to give it up for no reason at all.

OP posts:
R0wantrees · 19/06/2018 10:38

KaiserThiefs
It may be worthwhile looking at the schools Equality and Diversity policy. It will likely be available on the school's website.

A number of LAs have misquoted the Equality Act 2010. It includes 9 protected characteristics inclusing sex and gender identity. However on a number of LAs sex has been replaced by gender. This is a mistake and many of them have acknowledged this and corrected.

It is reasonable to assume that schools may use their LA statement as a template and so may have made the same error.

If the policy wording is wrong, this will of course likely inform subsequent decisions such as the one you have highlighted.

Link here to WPUK explanation with guidance:
womansplaceuk.org/grassroots-womens-pressure-forces-local-authorities-to-comply-with-the-law-over-sex-and-gender/

ToeToToe · 19/06/2018 10:37

Well done OP Brew

BettyDuMonde · 19/06/2018 10:31

Good call!

Fingers crossed for a nice, sensible reply (and a school office that remembers your query long enough to communicate more clearly in future)!

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