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Original poster

You are denying my existence

62 replies

ResistanceIsNecessary · 17/06/2018 21:21

I see this offered up on a regular basis in response to gender critical debates and discourse; that the act of wanting to discuss or question the potential consequences of the proposed GRA changes, equates to denying the existence of trans-people.

I don't understand this as an argument. How does questioning someone's right to self-identify as a particular sex class and access sex-segregated spaces, translate to denying their existence? Does this tie back into the mantra of "authentic self"?

OP posts:
Original poster
ResistanceIsNecessary · 17/06/2018 22:00

If you don't view someone in exactly the way they want you to view them, then you think they don't exist.

But clearly this does not stand up to even the most basic critical thinking! To use a rather basic example:

I have a 4 y/o niece. She is convinced that she is a pony. If I disagree and tell her that she is a little girl, does that mean I am denying her existence? Of course not. She's clearly in front of me living, breathing, cavorting round the living room pretending to trot and be a pony. By saying "Betty* you are a little girl" I am not denying that she exists as a human being; I am pointing out a scientific fact that she is a member of the Homo Sapiens species, not the Equus species.

*Not her real name!

OP posts:
Ereshkigal · 17/06/2018 21:54

Perhaps we should jolly well turn it back on them?
By inserting themselves into (and therefore appropriating) our sex they are denying us the struggles which go with making it to, and indeed existing in womanhood.

Stop denying our existence by making us a subcategory of our own class.

The problem is that a non narcissistic person can't do this like a narcissist can. And the narcissist simply doesn't care. The rage they experience is due to narcissistic injury. They don't consider other people's feelings as important.

FermatsTheorem · 17/06/2018 21:48

As far as I can see, it's entirely analogous to someone claiming that I don't believe in the existence of Catholics because I don't believe in the Nicene Creed. Of course I believe in Catholics. I just don't share their beliefs.

Postymalone · 17/06/2018 21:47

You exist.
You are not a woman. End of story.

CircleSquareCircleSquare · 17/06/2018 21:44

Perhaps we should jolly well turn it back on them?
By inserting themselves into (and therefore appropriating) our sex they are denying us the struggles which go with making it to, and indeed existing in womanhood.

Stop denying our existence by making us a subcategory of our own class.

CaptainMarvelDanvers · 17/06/2018 21:43

It’s roundabout speak, everyone goes around in circles while it’s happening even if you’re just an unfortunate passenger.

MaterialReality · 17/06/2018 21:39

It's a nonsensical argument. The most charitable interpretation I can give it is that by saying they aren't the sex they want to be, you're somehow wishing them out of existence. They aren't who they claim they are = they don't exist.

There's a lot of ridiculous hyperbole around this issue. Yesterday I read something on Twitter where the poster claimed to be upset that so many GC women were very pleased that trans people were dying of cancer. How much twisting of facts you have to do for that to be your interpretation of the criticism of CRUK?

Kyanite · 17/06/2018 21:36

They have to keep making themselves the victim...they're turning around everything that they are doing to women by pretending it's happening to them.

Ereshkigal · 17/06/2018 21:33

What I am doing is declining to agree with your belief that you are a member of my sex.

Exactly. It's not compulsory to agree with it. I'm sure some would like to make it so.

Serfisafleur · 17/06/2018 21:32

If you don't view someone in exactly the way they want you to view them, then you think they don't exist.
Makes sense to me.

Ereshkigal · 17/06/2018 21:32

It's a thought terminating cliche intended to silence discussion and avoid having to justify your position.

TransplantsArePlants · 17/06/2018 21:30

It's meaningless. No mate. I know you exist.

What I am doing is declining to agree with your belief that you are a member of my sex.