Woman's Place UK meeting threatened with "device"

Bit of a pile-on on this thread to say the least. I always thought there was a difference between being anti-TRA and being anti-Trans, but some posts on here have crossed the line. What exactly do you want from ClareFlourish? I mean as a consensus? Because I see posts written in what seems an attempt to satisfy one person torn apart by the next. We can't function like that as a group, which is what we need to be to help our cause. Being GC is one thing but I never thought it had to mean being transphobic too.

Do you think it's possible that you would ever be able to see transwomen as different to the general male population out there - especially the ones who have threatened to kill you and who have assaulted you

Yet at the moment, one of the main issues is that it is impossible to answer this question as a generality because I don't actually know what transoms now means. Until the definition is clear, how can I answer?

I wonder what definition you are using?

Transphobia being a combination of homophobia (real) and an irrational fear and dislike of GNC people (also real)

Ie anti-GNC not transphobic

I think you do see misogynists who are very anti-being gender non-confirming joining in. Being as much in favour of gender stereotypes as TG seems to be, but disgusted by TG for fitting the 'wrong' stereotype.

for thebewilderness

Juzza would you perhaps explain this part?
At worst, those of us trying to protect women's rights have people that are actually transphobic jumping on the bandwagon.

But also bear in mind I don't actually think 'transphobia' is a thing.

thebewilderness
Totally off topic. Mush?

Transactivists - why do you hate women so much that you seek to erase women?

Why do you men hate us women so much?

"Women have a right to speak out, to organise and to campaign for their rights. That is all Woman’s Place UK has been doing.

And, regardless of the slurs and hate directed at us, we intend to carry on.

June 2018"
womansplaceuk.org/womans-place-bristol-university/

I mean these people/MN are acting like this is the hardest thing in the world and we are asking for so much, but it's really just so basic.

Anyone with a microgram of empathy and any ethical backbone whatsoever should be able to manage it .

We could all talk another day about how awful it is for trans reputations (or you could save it for discussing with the people who could actually do something about that - trans activists.. )

But in the immediate aftermath of a threat to murder women when women are calling for solidarity in condemnation of the threat, banging on about your reputation being damaged as a side effect is callous and self involved.

All we needed to see today from Mumsnet and anyone else was simply this:

I support women's right be able to meet and discuss and organise for all of their rights. I condemn any activism that threatens women's right to do these things and will make every effort to listen to women and make space for them to speak.

No 'buts'. No 'poor trans too'. No ignoring what hs happened.

I'm really disappointed that Mumsnet hasn't managed to do this and irritated with trans people who just refuse to get what they are doing wrong here.

ClareFlourish

Stop spamming the board.

followed that up with a few more posts insisting that same thing over and over,when asked to stop making a thread about women being threatened with murder all about them said

I was responding to comments people made. It's usual practice to respond to comments. But responding to comments is then followed with 'you're making it about you' - well, it isn't.

They couldn't just express solidarity and stfu about how awful the situation was for them

It's possible to do both - this situation is awful for women AND transwomen. But transwomen are expected to be quiet about how this is affecting us as well.

It affects women and transwomen.

I wrote:

Kettlepotblackagain: "Do you agree it is up to you and those within your community to fight back against this? Are you directly fighting it and standing with us to stop the abuse and violence?"

I condemned the person who assaulted Maria MacLachlan, publicly and on trans forums. I am doing some work towards dialogue between gender critical feminists and trans people, though little has come of that as yet. I condemn that assault, and the bomb threat, here.

On Maria MacLachlan

I think the transgender group (sorry can't remember the name of the organization) made a mistake when they admitted they sent their allies to intimidate women at Bristol in black bloc gear.

One of the narcissist tests that I have applied to people since I was a child, having a narcissist mum, is that when disaster strikes the response is concern about how it inconveniences them.

Clare Im asking you why you thought women wanting political representation needed blavking out but not descriptions of violence towards women?

Also, that woman that got attacked was a lesbian. She refused to have sex with a pre op "transwoman" as she is only attracyed to the female sex.

Can you explain why you kept referring to her as a TERF?

Are all lesbians TERFS, or just that one?

It makes me spit, the way certain activists persist in being disingenuous.

Hello! Most of us here are women! The cunty type! We have, from birth to adulthood, experience of being women!

We do not listen well to men or their apologists telling us what we should be doing. Fuck off.

"literally did basically"

I apologise, I'm tired!

On the thread about this in Site Stuff yetanother literally did basically what Clare did early in this thread:

• made a quick vague comment about condemning 'people' who intimidate 'people'.
• immediately followed this with a statement about how trans people shouldnt be expected to condemn 'radical activists acting on their behalf'
• followed that up with a few more posts insisting that same thing over and over
• when asked to stop making a thread about women being threatened with murder all about them said:

They failed to see their lack of empathy with women today and made out that women being threatened with murder was as equally awful as trans people being made to look bad. They couldn't just express solidarity and stfu about how awful the situation was for them.

It's no different to what Clare did. I was really annoyed to get the same shit on two threads about the same topic from two separate trans id'd people whose sex I am apparently not allowed to point out even though it is bloody obviously relevant to this lack of empathy with us and centering of themselves!

Who do you think is not concerned about violence against women?

So transwomen who are really definitely absolutely women arent concerned about violence against women?

Why would that be?

But no, that poor lesbian woman was attacked by several people calling themselves transwomen and one transman.

Hippolyta, I did not black out that bit because my main audience is trans, and I was pointing it out as offensive. That is the clear message of my post. And the one with the fist was a trans man.

stealthsquirrelnutkin

BEST NAME EVAH!!eleventy1

ClareFlourish - then perhaps your efforts would be better directed at men who are bent on trying to negate women's rights? Rather than trying to argue against women?