Can we be honest about the need for affirmation?

Many women will not know they have a cervix
Sorry, I think you're wrong here. Thats basic knowledge which nearly everyone knows (barring people with learning disabilities, who should be getting support with health care anyway).

That's cool. Its just that I don't know if there are any figures and without statistics it just seems like an assumption that race is a big issue when it may not be at all. I feel kind of queasy when people start using race as an analogy here.

I'm glad your mum as had a positive experiance in her career and like me I have had little or no issue. But there are people that do and I have worked with a number to African nurses who have not been able to assist people with bed baths dolue to there race. Also a Indian nurse who was called offensive things. But as you say this is just. My experiance and is not representive of all people and I do not speak for them

Just catching up here and noticed:

Bespin
"As I have stated all patents have the right to decide who undertakes there care and accommodations should be made that is either getting another nurse or rebooking the appointment and as. I have said this happens all the time for a number of reasons. The biggest being race at this moment in time."

As people seem to be conducting this debate based on personal experience and anecdotes, I wanted to say that my black mum has worked as a nurse her whole adult life and is still going, part retired, in her late 60s. No one has ever refused her care based on her race in all those decades. I don't know why people keep referring to race when talking about trans issues.

Incidence of smears have dropped dramatically.
Some think it is because instead of saying women the advice to get smears now say people with a cervix. Many women will not know they have a cervix so they won't know it means them. But NHS has done their part to be gender inclusive and that is all that matters.

Do you have a source for this claim?

Also this appears to be linked to general issues with gp services.

Actions to be taken include

supporting local services to encourage more women to attend screening by providing clearer information
encouraging GPs to consider offering a variety of appointments earlier in the morning and evening, making it easier for women to attend at a time that suits them
developing an interactive database which informs individual practices about the numbers of women they are screening and how they compare with neighbouring practices

I would think that a more. Important factor in the reduction in smears. Is the lack do health education in schools and the wider general public. This is true for a number of routine tests that are declining in uptake.

Really?

Incidence of smears have dropped dramatically.
Some think it is because instead of saying women the advice to get smears now say people with a cervix. Many women will not know they have a cervix so they won't know it means them. But NHS has done their part to be gender inclusive and that is all that matters.

Bewilderness - yes to pointing out the special treatment for transactivists here

My interpretation of your post is that you agree with what many posters have said, but you don't want us to say it

I bet this is true. So well observed.

It's just men saying 'no you're wrong, it's like this...' and then repeating what you've said and everyone applauding their point.

You are correct the GRC as not relivent to this in practical terms as the enthasis is on the nurse not to distress the patent and respect there wishes even if they do not agree with them. They are to. Act in a professional manner and seek an alternative. This includes when people are adusive towards usz though at that point we also have the right not to treat them. If I had a nurse who had these issues I would. Seek to address this through supervision and clinical. Supervision and I would. Hope. That they could. Reflect how they impact. On parents and a just. There practice accordingly this is done all the time. For a number of issues if a nurse is unable to see the potential issues they can cause then this is a issue in relation to awareness of others again we can get this with people who are religious who are unable. To put there beliefs to. One side to work with people

What does a GRC have to do with anything though? From the patient's perspective it makes no difference at all.

As I have stated all patents have the right to decide who undertakes there care and accommodations should be made that is either getting another nurse or rebooking the appointment and as. I have said this happens all the time for a number of reasons. The biggest being race at this moment in time.

As smears are a specific procedure and you need to be trained in them I would be suprised if there are a lot of trans nurses again different to care assistants who might be covering and who take people in and support. That work in this area the teams that do this are usually experianced in what they do due to the nature of it. But with shortages at the moment maybe someone covered. Again details for this case are vague

What about if the nurse had a GRC and the patient still didn't want them to do her smear? What about a nurse with a GRC doing smears in general if their birth sex is still obvious to patients?

What I have issue with and why I posted is when people start to go off on generalisations of why or how trans nurses think or that this is in any way sexualised as people were starting to comment on I do not wish to stop anyone saying anything you can say what you like what I want to do is give you a real face to this as this is not theoretical there are actual people doing these jobs every day. You are all entitled to your views on this.

I will never make an excuse for poor nursing and it did look like that was the case. The person should have a GRC or the ccg would be within there rights to ask the person not to work in that area. So without knowing things like that it is hard. To comment on that case and the issues around it

It is very easy to say what happened. They apologized to the patient and explained that they had been deceived.

Bespin
I suggest you read the title of the post again.
You have taken us far afield with your adamant assertions that this never happens.

If I was in that area I would not do them as the potential for issues would be high and I no one comes to work to cause people issues.

My interpretation of your post is that you agree with what many posters have said, but you don't want us to say it.

The case that as been quoted as a few issues and there is a. Conflation between a health care assistant and a nurse in this one as it appears that they might have been a health care assistant. In this case it is poor healthcare not the fact the person is trans though that was the reason. What should have happened is that an alternative person should have been found, or if not possible the appointment rebooked as I have said this is a collaborative process.

I would be very surprised if this was infact a trana nurse who is routinely. Doing smears but probably a care assistant who was covering the clinic due to shortages. But there are few. Details around this so it is hard. To say what happened

Male nurses routinely still get the stereotyped responce that they must be gay all the time and there are some people who don't want gay man do in there care, and they too have the right not to have that person touch them. We all have the right to refuse personal. Interactions with people and.we do not need to state out reasons for doing so.

The smear issue which I have never done and would not choose to do as its not my area of nursing. If I was in that area I would not do them as the potential for issues would be high and I no one comes to work to cause people issues.

Well then. You agree with what's been said here. Why do you think there is a difference?

Totally agree and this is exactly. What happens now.

Well it may be largely what has happened until now.

But there has already been one high profile case of a woman requesting a female HCP for a smear and a trans nurse attending. When the patient said "I requested a woman" was told the HCP was a woman because they are trans. The patient left without having had the procedure.

Now that is only one example, but it's the one example that means it can happen.

Not only that, but until now it has been generally accepted that transwomen are male and, therefore, not women. The current rhetoric has changed to mean that we are being told trans women are women.

All women are trying to do is ensure that the current safeguards are protected. No one is trying to take anyone's job or profession away from them.

Again totally agree with this, though the. Britiah public are becoming. Far less polite and are far more able to. Express there views than they ever. We're and that on the whole is a good thing as health care should be a collaborative process. The organisation acts as the patents advocate in relation to the checks that it does on staff and will endeavour to provide the right staff for the roles.

While personal issues can and do effect how we care for someone I would. Hope that any staff would have enough insight and reflective practice to see the issues and act appropriately either removing themselves from the situation or. Putting the issues to one side.