Active discussions

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

Original poster

Can we be honest about the need for affirmation?

384 replies

FortunateCookie · 11/06/2018 21:54

I posted some of this on the misgendering thread but it was lost in amongst everything.

I asked on that thread whether refusing to affirm someone’s gender identity was a big deal or not, and many people thought it was, and that it could lead to mental health problems and possibly suicide.

If non- affirmation is so damaging then it also follows that positive affirmation would be extremely rewarding and fulfilling.

It seems obvious that this could lead to serious conflicts of interests. For example, in the case of the woman who asked for a female nurse to carry out her smear test, and was faced with a trans nurse.

Here, when the patients needs should be paramount, she instead becomes either a cause of huge distress, or a vehicle to experience the reward of validation. Either way, it is difficult to see how her needs could be centred against the pull of such a powerful motivation. Do eg hospitals, rape crisis centres recognise this dynamic?

Either it is a big deal that a trans person has their identity affirmed, in which case it should also be recognised that this can cause conflicts of interest in situations where affirmation or not is a factor (ie performing smear tests, working in a women’s refuge)

Or it’s not that big of a deal if a trans person has their identity affirmed and therefore they won’t be offended when a patient asks for a female nurse to carry out their smear.

Which is it?

OP posts:
Original poster
FortunateCookie · 11/06/2018 22:32

But we can add not being outed or singled out into the list of motivations, along with need for affirmation.

So the desire not to be outed or singled out is very strong, and could also cause a conflict of interest like the need for affirmation does as explained in my OP.

OP posts:
Original poster
FortunateCookie · 11/06/2018 22:26

If it helps, there is no danger of being outed in this scenario. The conversations take place in a closed room with only the patient, trans nurse and line manager, who already officially knows the nurse is trans.

OP posts:
GibbertyFlibbert · 11/06/2018 22:25

The question was answered.

Original poster
FortunateCookie · 11/06/2018 22:21

“The issue is less about affirmation and more about not being outed or singled out.”

So you would go for option B, that affirmation is not a big deal so the trans nurse won’t be offended if someone asks for a female nurse?

OP posts:
SameTerfDifferentUserName · 11/06/2018 22:20

Sarah would you like to answer the OP’s scenario instead of going on about fucking toilets?

TakeawayTakeMeAway · 11/06/2018 22:19

Like telling an overweight woman that she is unsightly and has to use the disabled changing room so as not to offend the other women.

That’s really a bizarre false analogy Confused

Ereshkigal · 11/06/2018 22:18

Males who think they are women are different though. So yes they do want affirmation.

SarahAr · 11/06/2018 22:15

The issue is less about affirmation and more about not being outed or singled out.

For example if a transwoman uses the male toilet, it will cause confusion. People will ask why a woman is using a male toilet. If the transwomen explains she has outed her self.

Or if a transwomen goes to a pilates class with a group of female friends. If she then has to change in the disabled rather than the female changing room she is being treated differently - and attention is being drawn to her difference. Like telling an overweight woman that she is unsightly and has to use the disabled changing room so as not to offend the other women. If the overweight women had gone to that class with her friends she would probably be very upset.

Ereshkigal · 11/06/2018 21:55

Good question. Interested in answers of pro trans posters.