I just peak-trans'd again!

So what about transwomen who claim to be women and identify as such but without legal documents saying female? Are they men?

Worked as a woman?

This gets more outlandish by the moment.

Then@CertainHalfDesertedStreetsif it isn't tricky please define male and female in such a way that your definition includesalladult humans

Including the ones with complex and rare genetic medical conditions? The ones who asked you to leave them out of it? Ah you got me. The whole edifice crumbles And that man I saw yesterday proves that we're not a species with two legs. Those Andean hut dwellers are still standing around scratching their heads too.

Men and women. Always has been, always will be.

Is it time for the pigeon chess meme?

So for you, to be a woman a person has to be able to produce a viable ovum to be accepted as a woman?

Nope, those eggs may or may not be fertilizable.

However, if your body is of the type which produces ova, you're female, if yours is of the type that produces sperm, you're male - and humans cannot switch between the two. If you are one, you cannot transform into the other, you can only imitate them superficially.

I think the answer flippingglibbert is in the name - intersex !! They dont have a gender identity issue its a biological one. Abnormalities during development do not mean there is a spectrum of male/female sex.

"You're screwed if you live in a hut in the Andes then. How do they ever procreate without a driving licence, passport and bank account? Maybe they have a different way to tell?"

Different society - which is why I said "lived and worked as a woman".

Daimbars
This is another example of a documented case of a "pervert with AGP who actually do illegal things"
www.newstatesman.com/politics/feminism/2018/01/marie-dean-story-shows-there-s-no-simple-answer-how-we-treat-transgender

I think there are quite a few more from a link I read someone compiled of sexoffenders who claim to be transgender

Anyone whose ID (driving licence, passport and bank account etc) is female

You're screwed if you live in a hut in the Andes then. How do they ever procreate without a driving licence, passport and bank account? Maybe they have a different way to tell?

"We're not claiming anything. We're pointing out a basic fact of life that my four year old understands. There isn't anyone reading this who is genuinely thinking 'Ah yes. Biological sex, such a tricky one.' "

Then @CertainHalfDesertedStreets if it isn't tricky please define male and female in such a way that your definition includes all adult humans

"If DP and I bump uglies, No matter what we are wearing, no matter how we feel, no matter how long our hair is or whether we are wearing makeup, only I will ever become pregnant. That has been the case since conception (although obviously the bumping uglies didn't happen until we were significantly older). And once I am older still, and no-longer fertile, it will still have only been me with the ova, and him with the sperm, and that is what made us female/male and woman/man."

So for you, to be a woman a person has to be able to produce a viable ovum to be accepted as a woman?

How can a bank account be female?

Is there a secret lady account that no one told me about due to my tattoos?

Those claiming bimorphic biological sex have stillallrefused to answer whether they believe the people on this page are male or female

We're not claiming anything. We're pointing out a basic fact of life that my four year old understands. There isn't anyone reading this who is genuinely thinking 'Ah yes. Biological sex, such a tricky one.'

I can see that it's a fact that upsets you for some reason. Therapy maybe?

Those claiming bimorphic biological sex have still all refused to answer whether they believe the people on this page are male or female

That’s because complex medical conditions are for doctors and the patients themselves to comment on.

As opposed to Self ID which is entirely a political proposal from the lunatic fringe.

There's no biological definition of a woman?? When I was pregnant I had to have several additional scans right up until the last few weeks of my pregnancy, including a MRI of the foetus, as it was possible our daughter had a condition affecting the development of her brain. This particular condition is much more likely to occur in girls than boys (and be worse if it does occur) so more tests are offered if a girl foetus is presenting with it. Should I have said "Nah, don't bother. For all we know she self-id's as a boy."

I think BrandNewHouse is actually suggesting that biology determines womanhood, not her own personal opinion.

Apologies to BNH if I have misinterpreted her.

"What is your definition of woman please gibberty?"

I have told you. Anyone whose ID (driving licence, passport and bank account etc) is female. In short, anyone who lives and works as a woman.

So you believe that the worth of a woman depends entirely on how well her body conforms to your personal ideal for a woman?

Jesus Christ, no, it depends on whether a person is female or not.

If DP and I bump uglies, No matter what we are wearing, no matter how we feel, no matter how long our hair is or whether we are wearing makeup, only I will ever become pregnant. That has been the case since conception (although obviously the bumping uglies didn't happen until we were significantly older). And once I am older still, and no-longer fertile, it will still have only been me with the ova, and him with the sperm, and that is what made us female/male and woman/man.

That's how life (literally, life) works. You know this, and you're just being an obnoxious bully to suggest that anything else is the case.

Gibberty, trans people do that all the time, try to use intersex or development abnormalities to explain ladybrain or born in the wrong body. It gets very old. People have explained this to you but you intend on ignoring the answers.

You have been indulged a lot here, and yet you continue to squat on threads like a sulking toddler. Is this the best way to help your partner? Do you get approval for doing this. Are you aware you are harassing and abusing women you don't know in order to satisfy your partner?

GibbertyFlibbert I don't know how you conjured that. I do not have a personal ideal for a woman, or judge women against something like that. I know how I define women, and men aren't it.
If some men identify with women, and wish to be treated as such, then I will do so insofar as it doesn't infringe on womens rights, but I cannot be made to believe they are women, nor do I think they have the same disadvantages in our society that women do.

BrandNewHouse is again suggesting that we decide who is or is not a woman based on how well a woman's body conforms to BNH's view a proper woman

What is your definition of woman please gibberty?

I answered you, already. Ages ago.

But as you are asking again 'belief' is not part of how I define men and women, so you are asking the wrong question.

secondtype.tripod.com/ais.htm

Those claiming bimorphic biological sex have still all refused to answer whether they believe the people on this page are male or female

Perverts? Are you calling Pippa Bunce a pervert Daim?