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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

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Original poster

Spreadsheet of local authorities that record sex not gender - let's complete it together!

130 replies

DJLippy · 08/06/2018 21:17

Started this in response to this thread
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3271841-does-your-local-authority-equality-policy-exclude-sex-as-a-protected-characteristic

We need to contact all local authorities and make sure that they record sex as a protected characteristic and not gender

Someone on Twitter (NorthernJugni) has set up an editable spreadsheet that anyone can add to. She’s added all of the local authorities

docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1hxZ6n4ovGRtGD2Q85NIrRnpGmMbdgc3XDsezQojxLXg/htmlview

It would be really useful if somebody could help those without much experience in contacting the local council by proving a basic message that they could copy and paste. It would save time and make us sound professional. Anybody feel confident with this?

OP posts:

iamawoman · 09/06/2018 07:42

I wouldnt bring trans into after all our concern is sex remaining protected characteristic, gender is too much of a variable and means different things. Lets focus on something that can be defined and is real.

SeahorsesAREhorses · 09/06/2018 07:30

Dover District Council has this

The Equality Act
The 2010 Equality Act increased the characteristics protected by previous Equality
Legislation. These characteristics are:
 Age
 Gender
 Disability
 Race
 Religion or Belief
 Sexual Orientation
 Gender Reassignment
 Marriage or Civil Partnership
 Pregnancy and Maternity

So that's not right is it, they're a no then.

Iceweasel · 08/06/2018 23:28

SameTerfDifferentUserName

This page uses sex (gender) like many of the councils are listing, could this be where they are getting it from?www.equalityhumanrights.com/en/advice-and-guidance/sex-discrimination

"The Equality Act 2010 says you must not be discriminated against because:

you are (or are not) a particular sex (gender)
someone thinks you are the opposite sex (this is known as discrimination by perception)
you are connected to someone of a particular sex (this is known as discrimination by association)
In the Equality Act, sex can mean either male or female, or a group of people like men or boys, or women or girls."

boatyardblues · 08/06/2018 23:21

We still have sex in leeds!

Ooh err Mrs!

AncientLights · 08/06/2018 23:10

I found a load of waffle on Bradford's. Will look again tomorrow. Surprising you have sex still in Leeds @Mrs Wooster@, with it being the home of Mermaids and all.

Yambabe · 08/06/2018 23:06

I can't edit it?

If anyone can tell me how I would be grateful.

Or if anyone wants to put in a "N" for sex mentioned for Warrington Borough Council and a note that they don't seem to have a published Equalities and Diversity Policy but both their recruitment policy and 2016 review refer only to gender and gender assignment. No mention of sex anywhere.

I've tweeted them to ask where the current policy can be found and to point out that the documents currently available appear to make their policies unlawful.

MrsWooster · 08/06/2018 23:04

I just googled leeds city council equality statement and it popped up. We still have sex in leeds!

Original poster

DJLippy · 08/06/2018 23:02

If anyone has struggled to add details follow this like here
docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/17_04bg_cSnls0DhvfUnikX7XpYjtiQktqXN_NZm3I7U/edit#gid=636976797

OP posts:

barnacharmer · 08/06/2018 22:59

If anyone else can, Sandwell lists sex

barnacharmer · 08/06/2018 22:58

Can't add mine, it won't let me edit

SameTerfDifferentUserName · 08/06/2018 22:53

Just found this. V recently updated so good for sending to confused councils.

www.equalityhumanrights.com/en/equality-act/protected-characteristics

North Lincolnshire list Sex.

Original poster

DJLippy · 08/06/2018 22:50

Can you add things?

OP posts:

Waddlelikeapenguin · 08/06/2018 22:46

Scotland's not on there either...

Original poster

DJLippy · 08/06/2018 22:45

OK I figured out - google - for info
'xxxx council protected characteristics'
Otherwise look in the Equality and Diversity section of the sight

OP posts:

OldCrone · 08/06/2018 22:41

I can't see my local authority on there. I'm in Wales.

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 08/06/2018 22:31

It's no wonder most of them are confused. Mermaids and Stonewall and their ilk have been very busy providing training on this area. Has anyone looked yet at the NHS or police forces?

Procrastinator1 · 08/06/2018 22:30

When I looked at West Sussex earlier I think it had clicky links to the actual act re protected characteristics, now I find this
"We are currently refreshing our overarching Equality and Inclusion policy, and so the policy is not currently available. Once the refresh is complete, the Policy will be published on our website."

Calls for some representations to councillors etc to make sure gender and sex are not conflated.

Original poster

DJLippy · 08/06/2018 22:29

Does anybody with experience want to share it in terms of how to navigate local authority websites?

I have no idea where to look! I am sure I am not the only person wondering...

OP posts:

Elletorro · 08/06/2018 22:27

If they don’t know their protected characteristics then most of their policies concerning those characteristics are going to be at best misguided.

Just look at Girlguiding

Elletorro · 08/06/2018 22:24

The letter is to councils that don’t know their arse from their elbow.

They need to be a little bit scared.

EHRC guidance suggests a separate space for children in school.

A third space would resolve the issue. Neither women nor transwomen would be discriminated against nor would either be subjected to a hostile environment.

I’d happily speak with Unite about their policy. They probably need some advice

SupermatchGame · 08/06/2018 22:23

It's one thing to suggest they use the correct term 'sex'.

It's another to then segue into an implication that they should not allow trans people to use the facilities of their acquired gender/ sex (except in exceptional circumstances) and yet another to suggest third spaces.

SameTerfDifferentUserName · 08/06/2018 22:22

Lincolnshire v confused. State Gender, gender identity.

Original poster

DJLippy · 08/06/2018 22:07

Sex needs to be recorded to record sex based discrimination

OP posts:

SupermatchGame · 08/06/2018 22:01

Apart from the fact that the opening appears very accusatory, it also seems to suggest that councils should not allow trans people to use the toilets of their presenting 'sex' or 'gender'. Most polices advise that they should. That includes Unite Union and the Equality and Human Rights Commission.

I don't do 'sides'.

Original poster

DJLippy · 08/06/2018 21:40

Which side are you on @Super? I was just about to mindlessly copy and paste but now I am thinking twice #OwnGoal

OP posts:

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