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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Magdalen Berns

81 replies

wowdidnthaveaclue · 26/05/2018 13:54

I have to be honest I don't think to my knowledge IRL I've ever met a transperson

I see the discussions but never has affected me enough to need to give, consider or argue my point of view IRL... until today

This woman is brilliant!

OP posts:
Mamaryllis · 27/05/2018 15:52

Lol. I’ve got trans friends and have had for twenty years, daimbars. Are we counting new wave? Sadly I know a bunch of teenage girls who claim to be boys too. And I’ve met a shit ton of para Olympic athletes (dd2 trains with them). Grin Not sure on the actual Nazis, but I know (or knew) a few holocaust survivors who definitely met some.
I saw Magdalen’s posts earlier - hopefully she is ok.

LangCleg · 27/05/2018 15:45

Lol. I've known trans women [not called that until very recently though] since the 1980s.

As have I! But the brains can't compute simultaneously being friends with trans people and having a gender critical position.

R0wantrees · 27/05/2018 15:33

Magdalen Berns' video that I suggested covers many important points. Some of which Daimbars had raised on a zapped thread.

Here's another Magdalen Berns video, 'Response to Trans Bathrooms':

SardineReturns · 27/05/2018 15:15

And I suppose that is the thing.

If you literally believe that anyone who says they are a woman immediately and literally becomes a woman then obviously they have the same risk of being a sex offender as other women ie extremely low.

Of course most people don't believe that at all and don't feel that saying the magic words "I am a woman" immediately confers on any and all men an almost total inability to commit sex offences.

And all women know that loads of men - enough for most women to have had multiple incidents - are capable of committing sex offences. We also know that they will go to great lengths in order to access victims.

SardineReturns · 27/05/2018 15:13

Why are people on about toilets again?

There are quite a few TW in prison for sex offences and violent offences, seems weird to say that they are incapable of sex crimes.

SardineReturns · 27/05/2018 15:11

The fact that, the aim is, for there to no longer be any terms to describe cunty people as a group, is an issue for all cunty people.

Obviously.

The idea that there needs to be no collective term for cunty people and that the previous well accepted ones need to be repurposed to mean something else completely is misogynistic.

We have spent long enough being considered by society, religion etc as non people - as chattels, as lesser, as men-gone-wrong, as sub-human - and still are in many parts of the world (and I would argue that the attitude hasn't entirely gone away in most of the world).

So just when the women's movements all over the world start to make real gains or at least get media attention - in regard to a massive range of issues from rape to child marriage to increasting representation in politics and different jobs and so on all of it... That there is a move to take the words woman, girl, female, and totally change what they mean.

This is of course not down to individual transpeople, it is a general and heavily pushed aim though of a lot of TAs, and it is gaining ground fast. Why it is gaining ground so fast - to remove the words we have for ourselves just when we are gaining some ground - is another question again and one with not many happy answers I think.

DisturblinglyOrangeScrambleEgg · 27/05/2018 14:55

Anticipating it will happen based on zero evidence and no reported cases in the UK seems pretty irrational to me

Plenty of men have been caught doing it. Plenty of men are men in public and cross-dress in private before coming out as trans later in life.

How do we tell which of the people flashing us/wanking in the park/planting cameras in the toilets at work etc. are men, and which transwomen who haven't come out yet?

Do you know how many women have ever flashed their penis at me, or how many I've seen wanking in the park? Go on, take a guess. Now, how many men?

That's why we don't want to lose single sex provisions. Happy to have gender neutral where it's appropriate, but there's no point to gender segregation at all - may as well admit it rather than pretend that transpeople are magically less of a risk than any other person.

daimbars · 27/05/2018 14:17

Keep on Googling. It hasn't happened.

Anticipating it will happen based on zero evidence and no reported cases in the UK seems pretty irrational to me.

R0wantrees · 27/05/2018 14:02

There are a lot of crimes committed in public toilets... most go unreported and few are prosecuted.

Baroquehavoc · 27/05/2018 13:57

A trans women has never committed a sex crime in a female bathroom in the UK. A man has but a trans woman hasn't.

How can you possibly know that? And only one man?

Pratchet · 27/05/2018 13:49

Daim: citation.

R0wantrees · 27/05/2018 13:08

"A trans women has never committed a sex crime in a female bathroom in the UK"

daimbars I didn't claim they had, though I'm also not sure that you can assert this as fact.

SeahorsesAREhorses · 27/05/2018 13:05

How do we tell the difference between men and trans women daim?

I worked in retail and met an awful lot of cross dressers with a fetish, are they women now?

daimbars · 27/05/2018 13:01

R0wantrees A trans women has never committed a sex crime in a female bathroom in the UK. A man has but a trans woman hasn't.

There have been a handful of cases in the USA and one 15 years ago in Japan.

R0wantrees · 27/05/2018 13:00

In terms of UK cases it may be that the site transcrimeuk.com has similar cases. It seems to have started in 2016 so any examples would, I presume, be in the last couple of years.

Pratchet · 27/05/2018 13:00

some reading material

Ereshkigal · 27/05/2018 12:59

There are lots of examples. I'm out at the mo but I'm sure people could point Daim to plenty of others.

Pratchet · 27/05/2018 12:58

Daim: the trans people I've met don't agree with you. In any way whatsoever.

R0wantrees · 27/05/2018 12:56

Daimbars The video is 18 months old so there may be more recent videos with similar cases.

daimbars · 27/05/2018 12:53

R0wantrees I've seen that video before but forgotten how much she is scraping the barrel. An example of a cross dresser going into a women's bathroom in Japan in 2003 doesn't have much impact.

Magdalen Berns
R0wantrees · 27/05/2018 12:31

current thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3259650-Lesbian-gets-banned-from-LGBTQ-messaged-board-for-trying-to-talk-about-the-lesbophobia-in-trans-activism
OP writes, "I have many transgender friends, and overall support trans people having full civil rights"

TERFragetteCity · 27/05/2018 12:25

I think this sums up about 98% of posters on this Feminist board.

Lol. I've known trans women [not called that until very recently though] since the 1980s.

TheChampagneGalop · 27/05/2018 12:21

Holy hell I can't help but wonder if it was politically motivated. FFS she is a very calm woman suffering from freaking brain cancer FFS. Glad the man stepped in, I hope they both are all right.

(If only us feminists would ever met a transperson, which we of course never have. Then we would agree with everything TRA's say and do.)

R0wantrees · 27/05/2018 12:20

daimbars
Just before your thread got zapped, I suggested that some of the issues that you had raised on it were covered by Magdalen Berns on her video, "Answering the question: 'Why do you HATE transwomen?'"

wowididnthaveaclue · 27/05/2018 12:18

@daimbars I didn't really need to meet one though to be affected by things.

Just by being a woman - I am affected

Aware or not of how

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