Dr Adrian Harrop, who the funk does he think he is?

Dawn's response is just perfect - Green Party should be proud to have her in their camp

Thanks, that should do it

I suspect harrop has a very fixed idea of trans women and hope doesn't fit his narrative.
Harrops aggressive targetting of women he doesnt agree with suggests he cant handle anyone challenging his views. So I would be hugely surprised if harrop took up hopes offer.

Sorry I'm crap with twitter links & it's not a proper thread as such. She's @DawnFurness on twitter.

@Plectrum Do you have a link to her response?

Bowlofbabelfish
There's some interesting training here:

1 in 5 NHS Trusts in England running SAGE & THYME training
9 April 2018
Listening to patients is a key part of their care in the NHS. Helping them to talk through their concerns can provide effective support, by allowing patients to think clearly and consider what might help them. Foundation level communication skills facilitate listening to patients and the SAGE & THYME Foundation Level workshop is believed to be the most widespread training programme teaching these skills - it is currently being taught in 1 in 5 acute, community, mental health, and ambulance Trusts in England.

www.sageandthymetraining.org.uk

Dawn Furness has given a fabulous response to the doctor's 'inquisitive' pondering. I do believe this emoji 🔥 covers it

Hope Lye has challenged him to a debate.

twitter.com/hopepinkboots/status/995675759288180736

Perhaps there should be some/more lectures from the liberal arts schools in medical training?

While my teaching offerings to medics were more of the hardcore end of the actual sciencey bits, I always picked up on anyone behaving like an entitled arse and reminded them that the nebulous thing called ‘bedside manner’ is pretty important. And that if they genuinely couldn’t manage that then they needed a niche where their patients were either out cold or already dead.

I’m also sure (although I’ll hold my hands up and say I have no idea how to source this) that I’ve read that there was some work done on who got sued in medical practice. Apparently patients will be more keen to sue a doctor who they feel is poor at the bedside manner stuff regardless of the actual ability level of the doctor and that doctors who were seen by the patient pool as being ‘good’ were in fact the ones who were perceived as listening/being more on the patients side.

Which shows you how poor humans are as a judge of ability but also makes the point that perception often trumps reality.

And shouldn’t he spend a little more time doctoring?

No definitely not. The more time he spends making a pompous arse of himself on Twitter the less time he will have to damage patients.

Perhaps there should be some/more lectures from the liberal arts schools in medical training?

AnnaMagnani

That's not the point I'm making!

Rowantree no-one in medicine actually care much about the Hippocratic oath.

It was just a fun thing to do at graduation and entirely optional. As I recall I disagreed with some of it - I think the bit about abortion - at the time, so I didn't bother.

It always makes me smile that some medics will say 'you took an oath!' as no, I didn't. And there weren't any lectures on it either.

From the version of the Hippocratic Oath rewritten in 1964 by Louis Lasagna,
"I will remember that there is art to medicine as well as science, and that warmth, sympathy, and understanding may outweigh the surgeon's knife or the chemist's drug."

Liberal arts education (Latin: liberalis, free and ars, art or principled practice) can claim to be the oldest programme of higher education in Western history. It has its origin in the attempt to discover first principles – 'those universal principles which are the condition of the possibility of the existence of anything and everything'. The liberal arts are those subjects or skills that in classical antiquity were considered essential for a free person (Latin: liberalis, "worthy of a free person") to know in order to take an active part in civic life, something that (for Ancient Greece) included participating in public debate
(Wkipedia)

Germaine Greer replies to a question towards the end of this interesting and important lecture based on her book 'The Whole Woman',

"I don't tell anybody what to do.... I don't want people to do anything but think and if they think about the issues that I've raised and they disagree with them, that's fine. I don't mind losing the argument but I do mind not having the argument raised at all."

www.youtube.com/watch?sns=fb&v=sVzYi4bRNwQ&app=desktop

A little ditty.
Ahem...

There once was a doctor on twitter who loved to witter and witter.
He droned on and on, telling women they are wrong and said “Fuck off you TERF’s you’re just bitter.”

I follow Miranda, and loads of GC people. And am not blocked.

I also fear that whilst there is concentration on this particular person's views and actions / LM's latest social media post /fall out from the GenderQuake debate etc, the very more significant lobbying of those in Westminster continues, perhaps with fewer challenges to encourage politicians to consider the wider possible implications of changes to the GRA.

Parliamentary events
9th May Caitlin Jenner speaks on Diversity
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3240113-caitlyn-jenner-to-speak-to-parliament

15th May Stonewall reception for MPs
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3223840-]][[Parliament-hosting-Stonewall-panel-event-on-trans-issues-and-changes-to-GRA

17th May Peter Kyle MP (Labour) Has secured a 3 hour debate in the Commons to mark International Day Against Homophobia, Transphobia, and Biphobia.

4th June Westminster forum on Next Steps for Transgender Equality
www.westminsterforumprojects.co.uk/conference/transgender-equality-2018

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3242812--Amnesty-International-Mermaids-and-Stonewall-have-signed-an-open-letter-to-Penny-Mordaunt-stating-the-importance-of-reforming-the-Gender-Recognition-Act

I saw on twitter that a character called James Haddock who actually admits not knowing what a woman is was recently elected. He gets no attention but has acquired a position of influence over BMA policy while attention is focussed on Harrop. There's like a group? Called Doctors for Change or Progressive doctors or something.

This sounds very similar to how a relatively small number of students with NUS LGBT+/Women's/Trans groups with a particular ideology have exerted a disproportionate amount of power & influence on policy which has wider and very significant consequences for all.

Wow, didn't really know about this guy before, but the way he's hounding Dawn Furness with a string of pompous tweets is way over the top. What a prick. I like this response:

Hi Adrian 👋 @DrAdrianHarrop I notice that you are scheduled to appear as a twatbadger / cockwomble on upcoming threads of @Twitter. Can you you please clarify your stance re: #shuttingthefuckup, and whether this lines up with the standards of normal human beings?

Goodness me, Dr Adrian is pompous, isn’t he? And shouldn’t he spend a little more time doctoring?

It's a clumsy way of trying to argue that you don't need to be in possession of certain body parts in order to be in the category woman. True. However, no woman has ever had a functional penis and testicles. Ever. I put functional there because I think there are some intersex conditions where women can be born with rudimentary male sex organs.

MB et al aren't interested in providing their own watertight definition of womanhood. I believe MB has said that it's not necessary for woman to even have a definition. They want to move away from a definition which fits 99.9% of women, to one that is so airy fairy and nebulous it has no meaning at all. A woman is someone who identifies as a woman. You identify as a woman if you have a strong internal sense that you are a woman. However, only trans women have this strong internal sense, if you're 'cis', and your body and identity are in alignment you won't be aware of this internal sense of your own gender. Welcome to the brave new world where only men can be women.

Part of me would actually like to see how far down the rabbit hole this could go if we let them have their way.

They've been stealthily trying to change the language used in the NHS for a while now.

Things like "pregnant person" instead of woman, "parent" not mother. Midwives will soon be so busy trying to get their trans-inclusive language just right, and asking endless questions about gender identity and pronouns, they won't have time to deliver the babies.

Also Adrian Harrop is the shock troop for medics who do not know what a woman is but are quietly getting positions in the BMA. I saw on twitter that a character called James Haddock who actually admits not knowing what a woman is was recently elected. He gets no attention but has acquired a position of influence over BMA policy while attention is focussed on Harrop. There's like a group? Called Doctors for Change or Progressive doctors or something.

PerspicaciaTick

It is grasping at straws that's all.