Mumsnet Grass Account

Nothing2SeeHere - have you apologised yet to the MNers who have been particularly badly affected by your actions, especially the poster who received death threats and people hoping that her baby would be stillborn?

Not Helen - DFOD!

@Nothing2SeeHere

Sakura we see and thank you for peaktransing everyone for us.

You are doing more work for gender critical feminists than you could ever imagine and we thank you,

Our audience has grown, followers have grown and more and more people, men and women, are questioning your motives behind such misogynistic behaviour.

Cheers

But I don't believe in gender. So how can I misgender? I shouldn't have to pretend.

Just as if you don't believe in God you don't have to pretend it is actually blood in the cup and not really cheap wine.

You said you are responsible for the twitter account. See screenshot in OP. If you are trolling as a team that makes it worse not better.

You want us to agree that humans can change sex?

Nothing2SeeHere Nope, you're doing just fine on your own! Answering any questions I might have had by your behaviour, thanks.

No Nothing. I'm not remotely interested in you.

Here is a nice trollhouse cookie for you N2SH

Apart from what pencils asked, I don't know why you wouldn't think that your actions speak loud enough Nothing2SeeHere.

We get you.

@Nothing. No. No questions to put to you at all.

Yes. Why are you posting here when you are suspended?

Nothing2SeeHere Nothing to ask, just keep going add more posts, you're #peaktransing people with every post.

Must be odd posting on MN is it Helen?

I think they need a crisis mode.

Things will go back to normal again I'm sure. My feeling is that the cat is out of the bag re trans issues and there is going to be a gradual reinstatement of women's rights probably with a lot of embarrassment of having gone against one's instincts and better judgement in order to seem open-minded and inclusive - a bit like the people who were suckered in by PIE.

However the MRAs, the sex buyers, the paedos and other perverts don't go away, and they will find a new way to attack, so MN will need to go into crisis mode again.

So I think it is worth looking beyond the current situation for a longer term view.

Agree re edit buttons being a bad idea.

Re MNHQ, it is very welcome that @katemumsnet has indicated that they will be getting back to us with a clarification re their guidelines. They seem to be pro-free speech on the boards except for what they find to be objectively harmful/wrong, i.e. they clearly think that talking about specific kids is wrong regardless of whether what is being discussed is what they and their families have already put out in the public domain. Even if you disagree, that is understandable. But deleting posts that 'misgender' is wrong, because that is taking a political stance: It is absolutely crucial, in order for MN to allow feminism on its boards, that MN do not have policies that prohibit free speech as it relates to gender politics. Allowing people to 'gender' based both on trans ideology and on gender critical ideology is the way you allow everyone to express their gender politics on the board. Also, many trans people base their pronouns on their sex, so MN should also be clear that despite what TA's aggressively insist is the case, this who pronoun/gendering thing isn't actually a point of contention between trans ppl vs feminists, it's two different forms of gender politics that is in opposition here. Both 'sides' in this believe the way the other understands gender to be harmful to them, and of course I would certainly argue that only feminists have the valid argument. But the point is, we should all get to express our gender politics, that is free speech. Trans ppl cisgendering me is very offensive and also misogyny, but MN won't be deleting posts where women are referred to as cis or cisgender. And it should be the same with regards to those trans people who feel that sex based pronouns are offensive; as free adults we get to debate these ideas, what we don't get to do is expect that others will just submit to them. And if terms like cis is allowed, then MNHQ cannot justify disallowing sex based pronouns, that is not treating users equally.

So I really hope @MNHQ decides not to take a position on gender politics in order to acquiesce to what is essentially bullying. There is no way that sex based pronouns is objectively wrong, so there is no way to defend deleting posts for this reason.

Lastly, as someone with ADHD, I have a lot of difficulty remembering in the moment to treat reality other than it is, so I would find it very difficult to use pronouns that aren't based on sex on an ongoing basis. It's easy to remember when that is the topic of conversation, but not when it isn't. These kinds of demands are very ableist in addition to everything else, and MNHQ will hopefully consider this too.

PencilsInSpace Definitely agree with getting rid of moderation by Twitter. There has to be enough mods to cover all the boards all the time. Remember the pub kicking out time trolls? YES training so all moderation decisions are fair and logical. This would help and stop posters being annoyed at the anomalies we have now.

Also the slightly sing-songy ameliorative tone of MN moderation which I think might be part of their core values, strains a bit against the call for gravity in situations like this - being in a bit of a war zone - as though the mods hands are tied and they can't come out and say. "Emma is a little wanker" or "keep your hair on mumsnetters we are up to our necks in shit and we don't need you stepping on our heads".

And please don;t forget quite how much slack many posters cut MNHQ and the mods.

Apologies for making more work.
Appreciating how hard things are.
Effusive thanks.
Gin, flowers and cake.

We cut you a lot of slack, show a lot of appreciation, show a great deal of understanding, give the benefit of the doubt. Far beyond that which is displayed to Twitter or Facebook or any of these other platforms.

I'm just trying to think of anything that could help both us and the mods to make moderating easier and fairer.

1. more mods to cover all hours and days
2. more training
3. tell twitter to fuck right off - politely but in no uncertain terms

The recent experience here is the sort of thing that reveals the professionalism level of the employees at any business.
I hope MN management is able to learn from the experience.