Posie: truthcrime harassment continues

Please do make sure that you're all clear about where the line is in terms of the discussion of individual children's anatomy (absolutely not okay in any circumstances), or discussing the anatomy of children in general in what can appear to be intrusive detail.

Protection of individual children: yes, I’m on board with that.

Not discussing this in general terms - how can we do this please without being deemed shocking? Because I cannot think of any way of discussing this that is not shocking. The very idea of it is shocking.

. I find FGM for example shocking and disturbing and I want it to be talked about. I find the affirmative treatment stream shocking too and I find the treatment of minors with irreversible and powerful drugs and surgery about as shocking as it gets.

How are we to discuss this in a sanitised way? Can we even discuss it in a sanitised way?

Many of us here on mn believe that all this will lead to future prosecutions from sterile/detransitioning adults who had operations/hormones thrust upon them when they were not old enough to make these decisions - I have seen several posters express this view.

I hope it is clear and unambiguous who will be held responsible at that time.

sallyannemum

I have two questions for you. Both are yes/no answers.

1.Do you believe humans can change sex?

1. Is castration defined as the removal of the testicles of a male human or animal?

Thank you.

They put their child on the NHS website FFS.

Hang on a minute.

If someone has gone on national television and given numerous interviews about their actions regarding their own child, and made public details of their child's anatomy and genitals - why can't the facts that the parent chose to put in the public domain be discussed?

I get the feeling we cant talk about something someone has done and said that they have done.wierd

Are parents allowed to sanction any medical treatment that they wish and to take their child out of the country for that treatment?

Only if they are white . I know that anyone remotely tanned who wanted to take their child to a place notorious for operating on children's sexual organs would have police and children's services all over them.

Absolutely Doc

I'm shocked that 1) that there was no charges brought on the mother for taking their child to another country to have an operation that was not permitted on a child 2) that the same mother seems to have so much power that she is having another mother investigated by the police for daring to speak about it

With working in the law know there are a number of similar cases coming down the line

please post carefully , if this gets to court Posie will require a great deal of financial support , not just words

I agree people should know the reality of what they are doing
Leaving a child sterile and without sexual feelings
Can we not discuss what is already shared publicly such as Jazz Jennings?

People should be shocked and / or jolted that such acts are carried out on children. I hope we never get blase about them.

What do you mean not discussed in detail? Are you going to ban discussion of 'excessive detail' of FGM? Would it be allowed to discuss male babies dying after circumcisions? Or is that too shocking?

I am astonished the police are wasting time and money on all this. I supported the @therealposieparker crowd fund and was fully aware of the terms. I have also received regular updates. Happy to make a further contribution if necessary.

Sorry for all the problems this is causing for Posie and hope she can stay strong. Really appreciate what she is doing.

Will contribute towards any action that can be taken against the police.

Do budgetary constraints from the austerity cuts deter official interventions

I don't think so but I'm no expert. They may have prevented pro-active initiatives in locating girls at risk for FGM, for example. But once treatment has been officially contested - it's usually a conflict between parent and doctor as per the recent cases of terminally ill children - the procedures are good. I imagine, in the case of a child with a trans identity who was being treated under an NHS service, doctors could equally contest treatment abroad if they felt it was not in the child's best interest.

So we cannot discuss the fact that in Canada children aged 13 are having double mastectomies?

What about FGM?
MGM?

Sexual development of children and the abuse that means they don't have one?

I think it's worth bearing in mind that Susie Green will be well aware of how questionable her actions might seem to others and how close to the law she has sailed. Founding Mermaids and promoting what she has done might be seen as her way of justifying and protecting herself. My guess is that she knows deep-down she's in a precarious position and people in precarious positions tend to fight tooth and nail to protect themselves. By making a huge fuss about Posie's words she may think that what she is doing is turning the spotlight in Posie's direction — but she forgets that that light is bouncing back on herself, and on Mermaids, and illuminating them too. This is the downside of her tactic: the louder she shouts, the more people will look at her and what she's doing and the more people are likely to be asking 'Really? Is this really a sane and acceptable thing to be promoting?'

We have highly developed frameworks for contested medical treatment in children - but the treatment has to be contested in the first place to set them in motion (by doctors, or social workers, or by parents if they disagree between each other, etc).

LangCleg Do budgetary constraints from the austerity cuts deter official interventions

Are parents allowed to sanction any medical treatment that they wish and to take their child out of the country for that treatment?

No. Parents have responsibilities rather than rights under the Children Act.

We have highly developed frameworks for contested medical treatment in children - but the treatment has to be contested in the first place to set them in motion (by doctors, or social workers, or by parents if they disagree between each other, etc).

This is why it is very difficult to find and prosecute FGM.

I am not impressed with the continued pusuit of Posie - free speech is a critical right and freedom in any democracy. Keep up the fight Posie.

Re the money: Isn’t there a specific crowd funding platform for legal fees that pays it direct to the appointed legal firm? I believe James Caspian used it for his action against Bath Spa. Perhaps people would be more comfortable donating directly to Posie’s legal fees that way?

Are parents allowed to sanction any medical treatment that they wish and to take their child out of the country for that treatment?

With regards to the idea of peaking the whole nation, I would suggest that the 'born in the wrong body' notion has gained significant traction amongst the public as a result of various TV documentaries.

People need to be disabused of that notion otherwise Green is seen as a brave mother who had the misfortune to have a child who was born in the wrong body and did everything she could to remedy it.

I support Posie and I am happy to donate more.

HerFemaleness

Does this mean that mermaids are acting lawfully if they counsel a mtf child towards genital mutilation, but not if they councel a ftm?

Does mermaids not council ftm children then. Do they offer them watchful waiting.