Posie: truthcrime harassment continues

Yes, me too!

Thank you :)

Id also like to read women discussing this without constant demands for evidence from someone who refuses to accept any and won't provide any themselves.

link to Linda Bellos' statement yesterday following CPS decision not to pursue a case:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3244214-Linda-Bellos-a-relief-to-know-sanity-has-returned-to-the-notion-of-British-justice-CPS-decision-not-to-pursue-a-case

JoanSummers
She has a website www.theposieparker.com

I'm so fed up of women being asked to prove silly stuff like this. You're the one begging the question Supermatch - you show us peer reviewed indisputable evidence that men who don't identify as men are different to other men, in criminal behaviour or any other way.

Yep. The claim that they are any different is for the claimant to prove. It has not been satisfactorily demonstrated.

I'd really like to read about Posie and what's going on with this, it's really off putting seeing a thread about a woman who is being persecuted taken over by someone who appears to be trolling.

Where is the evidence that men who identify as anything other than 'men' have different behaviour as any other men?

Quite. Why on earth would just saying you identify as something other than a man, make you any less violent that all other men?! I don't get this at all.

Where is the evidence that men who identify as anything other than 'men' have different behaviour as any other men?

I'm so fed up of women being asked to prove silly stuff like this. You're the one begging the question Supermatch - you show us peer reviewed indisputable evidence that men who don't identify as men are different to other men, in criminal behaviour or any other way.

Also

So in short, I don't really see what use that study is when considering 'trans people' today.

Goes for both those arguing again st the study, and those who use the study as 'proof' that transwomen are just as violent as men.

Of course its not up to me what other people post. just I don't see what use it is given it was only ever post op transsexual people anyway, which is useless today as 'trans' is so wide.

OK lets say that better mental health care did mean transwomen transitioning later had a crime rate similar to natal females. Why are transactivists fighting to remove mental health care from transsexual people? It seems nuts. But then again, most stuff transactivists fight fopr seems nuts, as they are on the whole just MRAs in disguise.

I have always been willing to believe that post op transpeople have a lower crime rate than men. Because I believe testosterone plays a part in how violent and such men are, and lowering testosterone will lower the violence. This also makes sense when you add in that transmen commit more crime when on testosterone. I think a larger part of it all is socialization mind, and I don't think you can realistically remove that aspect no matter what. But yeah, lowering crime rate makes sense to me. BUT, this is for post operative transsexual people.

You have to consider that these days, trans means anyone who says they are trans. And this includes crossdressers. And with sexual crime, crossdressing is a very very common 'hobby' among sex offenders. I think this accounts for 50% of transpeople in prison being there for sex offenses. As obviously, if crossdressers are classed as trans, and sex offenders are overrepresented in crossdressers, then sex offenders will be overrepresented in the 'trans population'.

Basically, I am willing to believe that in post-op transsexual people, they have a lowered crime rate than men. But, trans covers a broad spectrum of people now, not just transsexual people, and certainly not just post-op transsexual. And its these 'other trans' people who are fighting for access to female areas, who are wanting to be able to get a GRC without the diagnosis of sex dysphoria, as they do not have sex dysphoria. SO in short, I don't really see what use that study is when considering 'trans people' today.

unless you have a comparative cohort of men who also got better access to mental health care,

There is a comparative group of transsexuals - those that transitioned in the: 1989 to 2003 group, where we did not find a male pattern of criminality.

Where is there evidence that transitioned women now have a violent crime rate more similar to males than females?

There is no such observation. The opposite observation is made.

<
No the opposite observation is made only for those that transitioned before 1989. 30 - 40 years ago when transgender medicine and mental health services were less effective and stigma was higher. (In the researcher's words).

#IStandWithPosie and #IDon'tStandWithCastration

SupermatchGame
This is from Dhejne et al 2011, which I think is the study you're referring to.

In this study, male-to-female individuals had a higher risk for criminal convictions compared to female controls but not compared to male controls. This suggests that the sex reassignment procedure neither increased nor decreased the risk for criminal offending in male-to-females. By contrast, female-to-males were at a higher risk for criminal convictions compared to female controls and did not differ from male controls, which suggests increased crime proneness in female-to-males after sex reassignment.

That seems fairly clear. Where is the post 1989 data published?

That may be because that group was mixed sex.

I've posted what evidence there is highlighting the observation that they did not find a male pattern of criminality.

I think you're sealioning now.

This means that for the 1989 to 2003 group, we did not find a male pattern of criminality.

Let's hear the evidence for why they wouldn't have a male pattern of criminality, SMG.

The finding in the screenshot stands. It's clear.

You quoted out of context - even in the paper itself it states:

this was, however, only significant in the group who underwent sex reassignment before 1989.

You deliberately miss that out.

That is important because the transitioners from 30 to 40 years ago were subject to a time when: trans health and psychological care was less effective and social stigma was far worse. So not just mental health, but trans health.

Violent crime includes slapping someone in Sweden (not that that is ok). It also includes robbery and verbal threats.

However many times this is stated - verbatim:

This means that for the 1989 to 2003 group, we did not find a male pattern of criminality.

You don't want to believe it because it doesn't fit with your ideology.

Interestingly she also reported that crime went up in female to males. But you never mention that.

You have not provided any reputable, verifiable sources for me to investigate.

Light, Pratchet why don't you contact the researcher yourselves and ask her? If you want to investigate and you think this is important for the protection of women and girls - why don't you get it straight from the horses mouth? She makes her contact details public these days:

ki.se/en/people/cecdhe

?

Pink News exclusive:
"In 2017, the former Equalities Minister, Justine Greening, announced plans to review the 2004 law, which allows transgender people to gain recognition by changing their legal documents – but the process has since been delayed multiple times.

This has been partly due to pressure from the right-wing press.

Multiple departures from the ministerial position have also contributed to the confusion.

Mordaunt is now the third Equalities Minister since the announcement of this review — following the departure in April of Amber Rudd — it is currently unclear when the review will begin and how much of a priority it will be.

Reports last year stated that the review would begin in spring 2018, but there has been no further information about the review’s time frame.

In the open letter, the groups have highlighted the “humiliating” process the current law requires to change the gender on legal documents, as well as pointing out that transgender people face discrimination and abuse that remains unchallenged while the government delays the review.

“The longer this delay goes on, the longer abusive invective is allowed to continue unchallenged by a government who rightly pride themselves on robustly speaking up for its minority citizens,” the letter states....." continues
www.pinknews.co.uk/2018/05/07/exclusive-the-government-is-enabling-abuse-by-not-reforming-gender-recognition-groups-tell-new-minister/

link to current thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3242812--Amnesty-International-Mermaids-and-Stonewall-have-signed-an-open-letter-to-Penny-Mordaunt-stating-the-importance-of-reforming-the-Gender-Recognition-Act

I am so glad I wasn't the only one who got distracted by the nice sofa.

And the wall without fingermarks on.

Posie you are bloody awesome (and frigging gorgeous too)... dealing with all this where they'd have scared (and probably have scared) a lot of women away with their threats.

(Also anyone who can achieve a cream sofa not looking like an explosion in a sofa cushion factory in a house with children is a bloody miracle worker)

I hope Posie gets the legal and other support she needs as she is being targeted relentlessly