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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Hi Mumsnet, if you are asking feminist women to consider whether Mumsnet is for them, please be clear that the space *we* made here is for *all* of us.

338 replies

leyat · 02/05/2018 23:41

So apparently MNHQ is asking women they are suspending for saying things like men are men, to consider whether Mumsnet is for them.

I feel it's important to be clear that we want feminist women to have a home here, we - all the women who engage here - have made this board what it is (I'm relatively new so I am in awe of the women who have been shaping this wonderful space all this time) and we don't want women excluded from this space because they won't lie about biology and acquiesce to misogyny and genderism.

This is meant to be a kind of refuge for us, where we do not have to submit to male authority, where we can let off steam and share without needing to worry about dealing with misogyny, and where we can feel a degree of safety and find sisterhood. I can't think of anything more awful than a woman who comes here to share in this, in this one space we have that's meant to be ours, to then be told she should consider excluding herself because she won't bow to male authority on what a woman is.

So it needs saying, Mumsnet, this is a board for all feminist women, we don't want anyone excluded or made to feel that this space isn't for them too. And please understand many women come here from backgrounds of abuse, we do live in a climate of male violence and misogyny that is currently getting worse, so I hope MNHQ take time to ask themselves how they want to treat women who come here. Mumsnet own the site, but it's the women who use this space who made it the vibrant refuge of sisterhood and resistance that it is, so please don't shit on that or indeed on the women who actually engage on your forum.

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OlennasWimple · 06/05/2018 02:15

kr1stiina - I was just thinking that I would stick around after all. Maybe you will too? Sad

kr1stiina · 06/05/2018 02:08

am deleting my account after this post for just the above reasons. this no longer is a place for me.

AngryAttackKittens · 05/05/2018 23:39

Can I just point out the oddness of reindeers holding up fingers at all?

BTW I found your spiritual home, just a little early holiday suggestion...

www.visitrovaniemi.fi/

RosenbergW · 05/05/2018 23:25

It was actually radical feminists that came up with the terminology of FAB
^truth^
Fabulous FABs.

TRAs hijacked that terminology, and made it CAMAB (coercively assigned male at birth) etc. That is their MO, to rip off stuff and change it for their own purposes. Honestly, if they had an original thought, it would be lonely.
More truth. They're imitators.

Rufustheyawningreindeer · 05/05/2018 23:23

It had to be one point cos i couldn't find a reindeer holding up more than one finger

You'd think there would be loads...but strangely, no

LangCleg · 05/05/2018 23:21

Merci bien!

Rufustheyawningreindeer · 05/05/2018 22:58

One point...just the one

Hi Mumsnet, if you are asking feminist women to consider whether Mumsnet is for them, please be clear that the space *we* made here is for *all* of us.
LangCleg · 05/05/2018 22:55

That does not surprise me at all lang

I can still formulate a sentence though. Do I get a reindeer point for that? Pretty please?

LaSqrrl · 05/05/2018 22:42

Juzza and Bowl summed it up on the AIS thing.

I would add, AIS is an intersex condition, and NOTHING to do with trans. AIS people are genetically male, true, but also have a very female appearance (because of the lack of response to androgens). They also have a very female stature and body form too. The default human being female, these are genetic males that failed to develop along male lines.

It was actually radical feminists that came up with the terminology of FAB/FAAB (female at birth/female assigned at birth), the purpose of which was to be inclusive of intersex that had been raised as girls. A few years later, TRAs hijacked that terminology, and made it CAMAB (coercively assigned male at birth) etc. That is their MO, to rip off stuff and change it for their own purposes. Honestly, if they had an original thought, it would be lonely.

Rufustheyawningreindeer · 05/05/2018 22:27

That does not surprise me at all lang

LangCleg · 05/05/2018 22:26

I've been drinking. Jus' sayin'.

Rufustheyawningreindeer · 05/05/2018 22:04

Very odd hobby!!

AngryAttackKittens · 05/05/2018 21:57

I think scolding others is fun for some people, Rufus, or at least an approximation of "fun". If it wasn't why would they devote so much time to doing it?

Seems like an odd hobby to me but it takes all sorts, as my granny would have said.

Bowlofbabelfish · 05/05/2018 21:55

Cakes to ice... Grin

All I wanted was a yes or a no...

Rufustheyawningreindeer · 05/05/2018 21:55

Well that would be my response to the first one

AngryAttackKittens · 05/05/2018 21:53

My response is "have fun then" in either case. Or would be if I thought fun was something Supermatch was capable of having.

(Seems a bit dour as a person thus far.)

Rufustheyawningreindeer · 05/05/2018 21:51

Well i don't know angry

I can't work out whether super is off to get pissed or is saying posters on this thread are pissed

I have one response for the former and another for the latter

AngryAttackKittens · 05/05/2018 21:48

Are we all mean to be suitable chastened because Supermatch doesn't approve of us being radical feminists? Cause nah.

Rufustheyawningreindeer · 05/05/2018 21:45

h-oh. I might sod off now as the Saturday night drinking seems to have started

What?

SupermatchGame · 05/05/2018 21:43

Uh-oh. I might sod off now as the Saturday night drinking seems to have started..

SupermatchGame · 05/05/2018 21:41

Hi Angry. I didn't assume that at all - I've read your references to your dh several times before.

The strand of radical feminism, particularly the lesbian separatist radical feminism that dominates this board

I didn't say everyone with that view was lesbian separatist. Just that was one element of the very visible radical feminist perspective here.

Rufustheyawningreindeer · 05/05/2018 21:35

Apart from that bit...that bit i really disagree with

But the rest? Not so much

Rufustheyawningreindeer · 05/05/2018 21:34

Oh that was easy supermatch

Smile

I don't disagree completely with you at all

SupermatchGame · 05/05/2018 21:30

Ok

Rufustheyawningreindeer · 05/05/2018 21:29

rticularly the lesbian separatist radical feminism that dominates this board is not representative of the wider movement of feminism

Dont be silly