“Incel”

Good article by Feminist Current regular Natasha Chart. It links to a number of shocking cases of brutal male violence against women.

medium.com/@natashachart/if-hed-only-had-a-woman-ba2c58c3b6f2

Ewwww. That’s today’s “thing on the internet I wish I could unsee” for me. 🤮

sharing their sex dolls
Ewwww.

The situation is way worse in China!
the one child policy means vast swathes of men can't get laid
but they're not rioting, they're politely sharing their sex dolls
radiichina.com/sex-doll-sharing-app-launches-in-beijing-prompts-instantaneous-hot-takes/

One of my all time favorite quotes in response to the friendzone complaints of self styled nice guys is "Women are not machines you put kindness coins in until sex falls out."

This sums up the entire incel thing nicely.
Women don't 'owe' you sex by the way, dudes. That's what we call male entitlement.

icecat anyone who identifies as "incel" has a horrific attitude to sex and by definition is not a nice guy

www.wehuntedthemammoth.com/2018/05/01/just-another-horrific-reminder-that-incels-are-a-bunch-of-wannabe-elliot-rodgers/#more-29811

Thing is, it only takes one really determined person to do a lot of damage. The other 39,999 whiny losers create the environment whereby our one killer is emboldened and has his hatred normalised. So they do participate, because they amplify the signal, so to speak.

If that one bloke with the van had lived his life never getting in touch with this community, never having his hatred validated and amplified, and thinking he was maybe the only guy feeling like that would he have done what he did? Maybe not.

What you actually do about that I don’t know. You can’t censor people even if they are twats. Probably the way forward is to expose the ideology and have a strong sense of revulsion for it in ‘normal’ society, creating a social brake on it. The fact that there isn’t a huge outcry about sites and ideologies like this among men in general is rather telling.

Though how many of those were potentially dangerous to other people and how many of them were just self-obsessed whiny losers exaggerating and winding each other up is another matter.

Reading reputable reports there were 40,000 members on the closed reddit.

These are people who think that A Handmaid's Tale should be a vision of the future.

Re the cutting people off thing - did anyone else have the bloke berating a fellow vegan for buying an icecream from the icecream van for a child who didn't have money for one and was upset about it? He honestly thought that she deserved public calling out for it

See, I don't care which ideology this person is acting on behalf of, he's just a shitty person who's made it his mission to reduce the overall level of happiness in the world.

May a pigeon shit on his head.

True SGB

This also made me go "yes!"

The difference between men and women is that if women are single and not having sex, they think it's their fault. If men are single and not having sex, they think it's women's fault.

Women turn humiliation and failure in on themselves (or sometimes their kids)men turn it outwards at women.

Thing is, misogyny is thousands of years old. These 'incels' (or, as someone else called them, 'unfuckable hate nerds') are not actually peddling much that's new. There have always been men who insist that women are a kind of subhuman slave race. Remember that rape of a woman by her husband was not against the law until 1992.
We have made a lot of progress against male supremacy (and white supremacy), particularly in about the last 100 years, but the battle certainly isn't over yet, and probably won't be in my lifetime.

The difference between men and women is that if women are single and not having sex, they think it's their fault. If men are single and not having sex, they think it's women's fault.

Re the cutting people off thing - did anyone else have the bloke berating a fellow vegan for buying an icecream from the icecream van for a child who didn't have money for one and was upset about it? He honestly thought that she deserved public calling out for it (see also that prom girl in the Chinese dress).

It's like stoning but with a broader audience.

This hatred is not new. École Polytechnique in 1989. You can trace it right through. The Dalhousie dentistry school scandal didn’t go as far, but was based on a similar ethos - males discussing the sexual merits of their female student counterparts online. For all of Canada’s nicey liberal image, it was dealing in misogyny, hatred, and violence against women way before internet porn and the incel rebellion. Same shit, different century. Misgender a man who self-IDs as a woman, though, and you get politicians calling for your prosecution and maligning you on a social media. Men’s feelings are more important than women’s physical safety.

Yes I’m not saying it’s not an issue, women definitely experience more sexual humiliation on average than men I’d be willing to bet....more that the author describes it as ‘the ultimate issue.’

More about how he has sex objectified as the single most important thing in a life. And yet there are millions of celibate (by choice and not) women out there just getting in with life.

I don't think it is just a male pov.

Women who are unable to have children or choose not to have children are looked upon with pity and suspicion. There is a real social expectation which does affect women in different ways if they do not 'conform' and have children. Women who do have children but don't experience 'maternal feelings' in the way that society says they will also suffer and are distressed by the experience as if they have 'failed'. Also see childbirth and breastfeeding and the vocabulary and ideology of failure.

It manifests in a different way, but it is most definitely there.

Hmm. Women are often berated and shamed for 'failing in their sexual role', though. Women are frequently told they will be lonely and single and No Man Will Ever Want You for any kind of transgression or show of independence - and though a lot of women now react with cheerful satisfaction to the prospect, the fact remains that a lot of women have absorbed the idea that to be without a partner is to be a freak and a failure - look at the number of women who put up with all sorts of shitty behaviour from men rather than be single...

It is very interesting. Agree with almost all of it.

I’m struck by this sentence though:

According to Professor Juergensmeyer, “Nothing is more intimate than sexuality, and no greater humiliation can be experienced than failure over what one perceives to be one’s sexual role.”

That is quite a male viewpoint. Sex over everything.

Interesting article comparing incels and jihadists

www.nytimes.com/2018/04/30/opinion/sex-shame-incels-jihadists-minassian.html

Flipping heck, I would have blocked my Dad on Facebook, there's no way he would have been able to behave himself!
I'm personally very grateful that social media didn't happen til I was 26/27. God, the potential shame of being able to publish your opinions at 17

It's my least favorite youth trend ever! And does seem to be disturbingly common.

Back in my day we just dyed our hair black and whinged about our parents not understanding us. We didn't call them bigots and block them on Facebook.

(Partly because there wasn't Facebook yet, but still.)

@AngryAttackKittens - I have certainly seen and heard stuff (usually among the tantrummy, just-discovered-politics type of young people) to the effect that you should cut off friends/family members etc if they say the wrong thing or hold the wrong opinion. Or if they 'patronize' you. Or if they don't consider your latest fad to be The Most Important Thing Ever (eg you've gone vegan and won't shut up about it, but they still eat meat...)