Three tales of sex and gender

This is a good piece and poses difficult questions for those who believe that natal sex is completely irrelevant. It clearly isn’t. I think this will become more visible if IH takes this further (ie makes a request to move to the female estate)

Yes. I wish it wasn't necessary, but for her own safety she needs to know. Whereas with tennis or something it's just unfair, with sports that involve a lot of aggressive bodily contact there's a safety issue that can't be ignored.

Can someone DM or tweet this to Julia Hartley Brewer in time for her continuation of the topic on tomorrow's show?

Should I mention to my small but ferocious goddaughter that she might want to check the policies for university women's teams? She's about 5 ft 2 and fiercely competitive at hockey and martial arts.

I have a friend who used to play mixed hockey - until she ended up underneath two male players, resulting in two broken collarbones. There was no mal intention, they were just so much bigger, stronger and faster than her that when the tackle went wrong she came out of it very very badly

I was the only woman playing with men last night - non contact. As an above average woman player i can really only compete one to ine against average men. We have mixed teams but my male partner in a match is so much stronger, taller and faster than me. Reality (biology) sucks.

The team sport I'd have been most likely to play at uni if it had been available involved full contact body checking done at high speed. I am 158 cms tall. If I'd attempted to engage in said sport with male humans of university age I'd most likely have ended up in the ER.

How did people get stupid enough that they're even considering this as an option?

And this article from The Telegraph on universities/colleges going the way of letting students play sport in whichever category they choose. www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.telegraph.co.uk/education/2017/04/24/transgender-students-should-not-have-declare-birth-gender-applying/amp/

The ens game will be no physical restrictions. Look at how the IOC have gone and how little is required. We have Andreya Yearwood competing as a girl but with a fully male body. Now Rachel McKinnon demands no physical restrictions. www.usatoday.com/story/sports/olympics/2018/01/11/these-transgender-cyclists-have-olympian-disagreement-how-define-fairness/995434001/

See and I think the first criterion should be that one is female.

Indeed. Even getting the testosterone levels down to the female norm, which currently is not required, doesn't erase the other advantages given by being male. Those who are avoiding discussion of this are doing so for a reason.

Here's one difference most people may not have thought of unless they're fans of a sport where it's common - ACL tears. They're more common in women than in men because of the angle at which leg and hip meet and how that impacts the knee. Reducing a male's testosterone levels does not give him a female typical hip/pelvic girdle/leg/knee structure.

Only women should compete in women's sport - end of

Surgery and hormones do not a woman make - just a semblance of one

It’s not a difficult balance to get right. It’s not a human fucking right to compete at an international level in sport. If you are born male you compete with males (drug use permitting). Ditto females. If you want to compete outside the sex/drugs rules then lobby for a new category.

Men and drugs have no place in women’s sports.

moo, in a sport like weightlifting I would certainly not argue with that. The advantage seems too apparent.

I think biology has to be a factor in many sports competitions, yes.

It is a difficult balance to get right as there is no trans category just either/or in sport.

But it used to be more tightly controlled than now. They seem to have gone too far in the range of acceptance factors for trans participation.

We separate by sex for safety and fairness. I suggest if more categories of sports are needed the transgender advocate lobby for it instead of lobbying to replace the material reality of sex with gender beliefs.

So right team. Surgery doesn't affect the muscle mass on the rest of the body and nor do hormones, even if testosterone levels drop.

By all means, grow up male and decide to become trans, take hormones, wear what you want and have surgery, but just graciously decide that competing as a female weightlifter is Just Not On.

It's s good article. Very clear and concise. I think short helps tbh. I'd read reams of articles on gender politics but snappy ones like this are good for sharing with those on the edges who haven't thought about it very much and would balk at spending more than a few minutes on a sex and gender reading.

thebewilderness, one criterion for sports participation with women should be surgery. That's the only way to get T levels permanently down to normal ranges for any trans woman.

Mine have never been above 2.5T and that is quite common post surgery but more difficult to achieve otherwise.

The barrier seems too high from my reading of the rules.

It should also vary sport by sport as in some cases muscle density will be more important than T levels. And these will vary depending on how young transition occurs or length of time on hormones.

The current rules for trans women competing are a bit loose and not strong enough in my view and I think need reassessing to ensure they are more fair than they seem in some cases.

I am sure no trans woman competing would want it to be thought she won by default and that is hard for many outsiders observers to think at present. So it is in their interests to be sure that the rules are as equitable as possible.

We all know that the Emperor is naked. Men should not be competing in women's sports. End of.

The IOC has determined that males who measure 10 T can compete with women who never measure over 3T . Your are entitled to consider that fair if you so desire.

t.co/z111jauXer?amp=1

This is an interesting article about how the IOC really don't care if women are cheated out of medals as long as they make lots of money.

TGLWGH.

Great article.

Laurel Hubbard
The IOC, after listening to the evidence, has set the criteria by which it is fair for transwomen to complete in competitions. And by fair I mean, transwomen do not have an advantage over natal women. Other sporting organisations tend to follow the IOCs lead. As Laurel Hubbard has followed the rules, then she should be allowed to compete.

If Helen wishes to argue this is unfair, then she needs to present evidence which is more compelling than the evidence the IOC viewed.

Ian Huntley
If Ian Huntley sincerely and genuinely identifies as a women, completes a process to reassign his gender and can be safely managed in the women's estate, then he should be transferred. However, I don't think anyone believes he is sincere. Still if he is transferred, maybe he would get to share a cell with Rosemary West.

Tara Wolf
Here the district judge, following the court rules, requested that Tara be referred to by her preferred pronoun of she. He and she - don't have a specific legal meaning - so it is just a matter of courtesy.