Caitlin Moran in today's Saturday Times

If I'd been stopped in the street, I'd have probably said I wasn't a feminist too. I would certainly have been grateful for everything feminists in the past had done. But I wouldn't have thought of myself as a feminist.

I've not been on these boards for long. And I still don't know all of what feminism is about. But it was a real surprise that opposing gender stereotypes (something I've quietly done all my life - well, since I was about 3) is actually part of feminism (if I'd thought about it, it probably wouldn't have been a surprise. I just never thought about it).

Most Feminists seem to be the liberal feminists who totally support every trans demand and hate any woman or feminist who is gen critical. So although i agree with the original core aims - feminism seems to have evolved mostly into something I don’t feel i really have a place in.

She's active on Twitter, maybe someone with clear thoughts and a hard skin could approach her (ie not me )?

I was cheering her on until the paragraph at the end.

Women are not forgoing an education or giving up work. I'd say that when it comes to parental leave or looking after elderly parents, it is overwhelmingly more likely to be the woman who gives up work.

Women are not abandoning contraception or leaving politics. Given that Venice Allan and Jennifer James have been suspended from the Labour party and subjected to a campaign of personal and professional smears for defending women's rights, that's a hard line to swallow.

Women and men are not teaching their young daughters to be quiet, pliant and pretty; or their sons to objectify, or feel entitled to beat, their girlfriends. I think a significant number of them are. Subconsciously perhaps, and passively, but that's the effect of gender stereotyping, which we all know is alive and well in 21st century Britain.

Millions of women are tweeting their #MeToo and #Time’sUp stories. They’re revealing unequal pay structures at work. They’re demanding change. They’re absolutely presuming the future will be better for women. Lots of women - lots of feminists - don't 'absolutely presume the future will be better for women'. Lots of them are very fearful that the opposite will prove to be the case. But they're not allowed to talk about why, because that is transphobic and people will shut them down and call them TERFs.

circle I also got told in an intersectional feminist group that Caitlin Moran is "problematic".
Apparently something she wrote about strippers in HTBAW was swerfy.
She got a huge kicking online a few years back, I'm not surprised she keeps quiet on trans matters

Ritzsaltedcrackers

Thank you for that article. I occasionally worry that my dislike of Caitlin Moran is irrational but that talk of "girls in sex work" shows it isn't.

Sigh.

It’s from 2016. Let’s hope her ‘feminist girls’ have had a word with since then.

Cannot bear these wide eyed lib fems with their faux bewilderment. But WHY can’t everyone just be a cool girl like ME and let the nice trans women in the loos so we can swap make up tips?

thedebrief.co.uk/news/celebrity/caitlin-moran-back-kick-ass-ever/

I think they consider her a TERF because of something in her How to be a Woman?
I remember a huge kick off about her supporting Lena Dunham (or more accurately not calling her out for the lack of white peoples in Girls) and then it spiralling from there. This must have been about 2011/12.

like

She wrote something totally mindless a few years back about how she didn’t get why women and transwomen don’t get on as we are all after the same thing and are all sisters or something massively libfem Luke that. I do hope her thinking has evolved since then a little.

And she’s intelligent to see that it’s madness

The article from 2011 refers uncritically to a 10 year old boy having "gender realignment surgery"

Really? How?

I consider her (from reading her work) to be a lib fem. Interestingly most of the trans people I know IRL, along with the TRAs online, consider her a massive TERF.

I find her extremely irritating. Here are a couple of articles. They are oldish.

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/transgender-politics-v8bj3529cfq

www.buzzfeed.com/annanorth/why-feminism-cant-afford-to-ignore-transgender-wo?utm_term=.dmLye0rY7#.qq9Q0L2PG

She’s a total disappointment. Writes books on feminism but is too cowardly to speak up about the trans madness. And she’s intelligent to see that it’s madness.

@terryleather yes and it's especially disappointing given her generally good grasp of class analysis. But I'm waiting for her to put a foot wrong. Then she'll see.

I'd always regarded CM as very much a libfem and can't imagine her ever saying anything gender critical.

Would be happy to be proved wrong though...

MRAs always come out of the woodwork when there's an article by a well known feminist.

Ugh the comments

“The investigation into the CPS revealed police were trained to conceal evidence to get rape prosecutions up. We’re also imposing an unlimited fine on companies because college educated women can’t understand disparity doesn’t equal discrimination when it comes to pay.
If you’re still a feminist at this stage you’re mentally ill beyond all help and I pity you. To frame it in language you’ll understand — you’re so mired in privilege you can’t see it, ladies.“

Not a conspiracy theory.

Founded, it's my reaction I'm describing.

NowToWork

There is no doubt that a lot of people find words like patriarchy and women's oppression to be a bit eye roll inducing.

And I can see why.

But when the concept is explained, people tend to agree, but still have a problem with the wording.

Maybe a better wording would be chauvinistic society, instead of patriarchy? And disadvantage to women, instead of oppression?

Two women a week killed by men, 85,000 women a year raped by men and the #metoo campaign running to 11,000,000 posts in under 24 hours would indicate that feminism is indeed necessary. Despite laws that aim to address these issues.

The only reason to disagree that women are 'disadvantaged by a chauvinistic society', is if you disagree that sexism exists.

When there is a wealth of evidence to the contrary, from men being the default for heart-attack symptoms, crash test dummies failing women as they conform to male physique, women being discouraged from stem subjects, and having no autonomy over their own bodies.

The disadvantage to women in our society isn't an opinion.

Equality of opportunity, is obviously a good thing. Ensuring that women can be educated, for a start.

But the reason equality of outcome doesn't happen is because of sexism. Unless you just think that women are disadvantaged by choice.