A Woman's Place is Speaking up in Wales (Cardiff Meeting next week)

The people who spread misinformation know what they are doing, they taking a leaf out of the Russian Bots playbook. Spread lies so much that most people will just accept it’s the truth.

YY it was done quite successfully with the Speakers Corner attack.

There were no slides.

That's an outright lie.

No. Slides.

The change of venue meant that the equipment for slides wasn't available.

Spread lies so much that most people will just accept it’s the truth

That's a similar thing that some people who oppose self ID and people who are very much pro self ID do as well.

Keep repeating dubious statistics until it becomes truth.

It's hardly the first time this has been raised but Crispbuttyfan's comments make a good opportunity to restate: I was subjected to an attempted rape a few weeks after my 13th birthday. If I had been scheduled to go on a residential trip, knowing there may be a penis owner in the shower or bed next to me, would I have gone? The answer is so resoundingly obvious that I will be greatly suspicious of the motives of anyone who gives a contrary answer. You'll have totally outed yourself as sick.

The people who spread misinformation know what they are doing, they taking a leaf out of the Russian Bots playbook. Spread lies so much that most people will just accept it’s the truth.

Sorry, naming people (though guiliana is tagged in the screenshot) probably isn't "going high"...

Yeah there were no slides - not that the truth has stopped people like guiliana making up their own defamatory bullshit in the past

Also, those screenshots and stuff from Twitter are making me want to scream. Another reason to remind everyone to keep cool.

Can I just say, because I'm highly frustrated and irritated as a lurker on this thread by some of crispbuttyfan's comments, that perhaps any posters feeling the same might take a break or something to help with #WTGLWGH. Peace and love.

There’s a worrying amount of hate trying to be whipped up around the school that’s supposed to have been used as a venue.

There’s also lies being spread about slides being shown to mock people.
I don’t think the venue had any facilities to show slides due to the change in venue so the speakers just used paper notes.
But I guess all those spreading this hate aren’t going to bother with a few irrelevancies such as the truth.

Any male who refuses to understand or accept that girls need boundaries is not a trustworthy person.

Do your daughters feel the same way about handling their menstrual needs in the presence of boys, crispbuttyfan or have you adequately explained to them that they aren't allowed personal boundaries once those boys feel they are girls?

Yep CisMyArse. They're actually going to start bullying a Primary School now. Talk of "lawsuits" to make "focus their attention" even a call for for the school to be shut down.

That is a predictably childish response from the Wales equality people. Why don’t they actually come to a meeting and see for themselves I wonder ? Perhaps because they don’t want to accept that people have reasonable concerns that aren’t based in bigotry ? Far easier to shout hate and bigotry and frighten people into not listening to debate. This won’t be effective in the long run though, we need to have this conversation to establish legislation that works for girls and women, 52 percent of the population. Like every feminist I’ve ever met I want trans identifying people , like anyone else, to live happy lives free from harassment. What I don’t want is for females to lose their sex based protections. Sex matters. From safety to data collection to health care, sex matters. To try and gaslight a whole nation into believing that sex is a construct and identity is all, is never going to work. I’ve lived my entire life without having an “identity” . The world is in a perilous state, we should be trying to look outwards and sort of the problems of poverty, war, the environment, not selfishly focusing on the nonsense that is “identity “. I don’t identify as a woman, I am a woman.

I don’t know a single parent who would be comfortable with their daughters sharing changing or sleeping facilities with males.
I also have several friends who experienced sexual abuse as children and older teenagers.
Aside from that, most teenage girls naturally want privacy to change. I grew up with a brother I got on with really well ,but both of us wanted privacy once we were going through puberty. Not letting girls and boys too. have their natural boundaries, is rape culture.

This is awful. As you say, why not come along and engage in debate? I'm really concerned for the people involved. Why aren't they understanding the WPUK's very clear demands? I suspect the word 'demands' riles abs irritates a few people - how dare women be resolute in what we want.

Quite MsBeaujangles

Morning crisp. Do you agree that humans are sexually dimorphic?

Crispbuttyfan - so the teenage girls who are uncomfortable with changing in front of a transitioning transgirl are trumped by those whose parents have "zero problem" ?

Right. Gotcha.

An awful lot of teenage girls are uncomfortable changing in front of anyone - I know I was. Their feelings are valid, and should be respected. We should not expect young girls to have their own instinctive boundaries eroded like this, because some parents have "zero problem".

crisp I presume you'd d away with all sex-based provision then? There is no point in sexed based provision that doesn't categorise by sex.
I can't see any point of gender-based provision when it comes to dressing, undressing, sleeping etc. In what way does identity matter in these circumstances?

CisMyArse, it's here:

twitter.com/Wales4Equality/status/984792111311618048

Sirvix

nice projection except I have a teenage daughter and an almost teenage daughter, and I would have zero problem with them sharing facilities with trans girls, like many other parents, so....

@CisMyArse Cardiff Feminist Network are taking the credit for getting the Mercure to cancel, one admin is boasting that she is on this thread "monitoring" it, someone is asking about who the choir are so that they know who their enemies are and they are complaining to the Labour Party, LEA and the school about a school governor who is "forcing the school to break the Equality Act." One is also urging others to harass MNHQ.

I am disgusted with women silencng other women especially the implied threat to a choir and a primary school, big cowards. If WP are so wrong, turn up and debate with them. Have a meeting with them. Invite them to CFN and talk. Take the opposite side in public debates and on the radio and on talk shows. Hassling a primary school for the crime of allowing women to meet together and accusing a choir of being your enermies what century is this again.

Thanks Gasp0de. Will have a look. Am really concerned for the bod who permitted the meeting - they'll be a target and I want to lend my support.

Love the name btw - possibly one of my favourite TP characters

From crispbutty
"I'm not sure somebody feeling uncomfortable would be a basis alone for triggering a plausible exemption."

I don't really know where to start when talking about this. I thought the whole point of the transpersons' argument was that they don't "feel' like their biological sex fits their personality?

So women have to give up their enshrined in law rights to sex-segregated spaces because some people don't feel happy about it but parents of girls aren't allowed to feel apprehensive about their daughters sharing said sex-segregated spaces with male-bodied adolescents?

I went to the Cardiff meeting, it was brilliant, sensible, level-headed, full of good humour. I did not hear one single snide or defamatory word said against transpeople. The discussion was political, women applying critical thinking to an issue that affects 52% of the population, with particular concern that our daughters and granddaughters do not lose any of the hard-won rights of the C20th.

It was in Pink News, I think. Quite a lot of references on Twitter. The Times today has a good opinion piece by Janice Turrner which refers to it too (TRAs going after a governor of the primary school who they suspect arranged the use of the school hall). (The Times also has a good news article about the outcome of Tara Wood's trial.)