Transgender Weightlifter Story in Daily Mail! - will they let the comments through?

And now this

gendertrender.wordpress.com/2018/04/09/no-hormones-boston-marathon-to-allow-men-to-compete-as-female-on-the-basis-of-feelings-alone/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

I'm embarrassed to be a Kiwi at the moment.

From the BBC news today:

The Australian Weightlifting Federation had formally complained about her participation, and the president of the Samoan federation also voiced his opposition.

Commonwealth Games Federation chief executive David Grevemberg said the issue needs "robust debate".

I've been looking at 'normal' testosterone levels, I use inverted commas as I know there is a lot of natural variation. Women it is way down 0.3-1.7 and men's range is 8.6-29. www.southend.nhs.uk/pathology-handbook/test-directory/test-directory-t-index/testosterone/

The IOC have decided that to compete as a woman you have to have testosterone under 10, so this guy might not even be reducing his testosterone levels at all and be eligible to compete!

Plus that is not the only physical factor in being a 'woman', physical size, heart and lung capacity etc.... but this seems to be the only thing required to meet the IOC criteria.

Yet when a woman, Caster, has naturally higher levels of testosterone she is vilified, and was/is treated appallingly.

Popchyk I totally agree. And NZ is talking about having LH as their flag bearer at the closing ceremony because they are such an inspiration to LGBT sport. Rubbish. Off the top of my head, I can think of at least half a dozen L or G who compete (or have competed) and win (won) at the highest level. Obviously, they were competing on equal terms and no one batted an eyelid.

Found it now, thanks.

What utter bollocks

Lapdance, I was quoting Mallorie's post at 09:13.

That was a quote from one of the articles linked.
Indominusrex I was wondering if LH got the women's commonwealth record how many that would peak trans.
I'm still gutted for Duangaksorn Chaidee who was a junior championships but was relegated to 4th after LH won silver so missed out on one of her first medals competing at an adult level. How demoralising for her

Who said that, Popchyk?

“And no other athlete at these Games is as important, given the gradual fight for LGBT rights in and outside of sport.”

That is just nonsense.

The Ls, the Gs and the Bs have always been in sport.

They compete as THE SEX THEY ACTUALLY ARE.

I'm gutted Hubbard pulled out. Would have relegated Emily Campbell to 4th and meant a massive peak trans moment.

Does nobody think of the inherent unfairness towards trans men (women who identify as men) in sport?

They will never compete at an elite level against men, because their bodies are female. Their transgender identity prevents them from competing at all.

But, somehow, that seems to be absolutely fine with the TRAs. No talk about ways to inclusion for female-bodied transgender people.

As always, it is about how to promote and encourage men and how women should move over for them.

Testosterone is not the only factor in men’s generally higher achievements in sport, & that shouldn’t be the only measure the authorities use if they insist that allowing transwomen to compete in women’s sports is fair.

There are areas where women can compete equally because it’s about skill rather than strength (equestrian, sailing, shooting) & a couple where they’re actually better (long distance swimming & running)(plus climbing in tricky corners ) but otherwise men have natural physical advantages.

I found a really interesting article earlier about scientific testing of athletes - they found some females had higher natural levels of testosterone than some males. Can’t find it again now of course.

So unfair on Tracey Lambrechs too - she won a bronze for NZ in the 2014 games in Glasgow, but was forced to lose 17kg last year to change weight categories, after Hubbard took her spot in this weight class.

To take this issue a bit further.
If a TW takes part in a team sport such as rowing or rugby and then they win and break records etc, the rest of the women are likely to face the backlash aren't they?

Hubbard's testosterone levels were high enough at some point to make Hubbard lose Hubbard's hair. I'd hazard a guess through male pattern baldness.

Mallorie

Too right

It's such bullshit

Inspiring to whom? What rights does Hubbard lack?

Mr Marshall said Hubbard's testosterone is lower than a normal female's, and that she has met all requirements.

Which shows clearly that the 'requirements' at the moment are wrong. Women's sports should be for people with XX chromosomes, plus some intersex (who probably need individual assessment and are nothing to to with the case of XY transgender men).

The latest dm report has similar comments from people saying that it was never a fair competition.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5593299/Transgender-weightlifter-Laurel-Hubbard-withdraws-Commonwealth-Games-elbow-injury.html

No other athlete shines as bright a beacon for inspiration and equality as Hubbard,” Shannon wrote.

“And no other athlete at these Games is as important, given the gradual fight for LGBT rights in and outside of sport.”

Are you fucking kidding me.
I'm not inspired by a person with the body and muscle mass of a man my age lifting more weight than me (and yes, injury is much more likely)
I'm inspired by the women my age showing me what I could be capable of, but there aren't any at the commonwealth games because older women usually can't lift as much as younger women.
The fact that LH immediately started snatching at 120kg, a weight the others couldn't start at, shows the difference. The current commonwealth record for that is 125kg. (Olympic is higher because Russia and China...)
LH was going for the commonwealth record with no effort before the injury (and it looked like a proper injury tbf, I hope they're ok)
Would they have declared LH the commonwealth women's record holder? Because that's bullshit.

I am not an expert in weightlifting at all, but I wonder if although Hubbard can outlift any woman on pure strength, Hubbard's age makes them more prone to injury?

The virtue-signalling of wanting her to be the flag-bearer!

This is one of things that needs to be properly discussed at the highest level.

I will link the thread with the petition here in case there is anyone that hasn't seen/signed it.

Details here

While I can't believe Hubbard doesn't know full well competing is unfair on women, I think the focus should be on the rules which allow transwomen to compete in women's sports. We need to get back to a clear distinction between gender and sex, and that sports are segregated by sex not gender.

There are many people who have medical or psychological issues which prevent them participating in the activities or professions they love. I don't see how being transgender fundamentally differs from these.

Sorry, I should have mentioned to scroll down to the section about the injury. It's the fourth item down at the moment, but will probably drift further down as new results come in.