Ulster Rugby Rape Trial - Not guilty to all charges

@Angelsoul2k15uk I have been to many many parties! I have went upstairs with boys and kissed them, when they tried to take it further I said no. They said ok, we kissed some more and went downstairs! So no my daughter has a right to say no at anytime, just like any woman

I think to myself as a student in Belfast - I was asleep drunk on a guys bed who I was seeing at the time. I woke up he had gone and his housemate was looking up my skirt. I didn't say no to him - so was that ok? Did I do anything about it - no, it didn't cross my mind I could. I think most girls will have a story of #metoo

I won't even get into the worse ones

@wordtothewise I have not said the guys are guilty - I have said taking that out of account they are still vile, from their messages and disrespect of other human beings.
Based on this they are not who I would choose to represent my country.

I also don't think a girl will put herself through that if she truly doesn't believe she was raped. However I think it comes down to did they believe they didn't have consent. I'm not sure that they were so egotistic that they don't believe of course she would want to have sex with them.

I think the fault comes down to our laws. Men and women should have to seek consent - are you ok if I touch you, are you ok to do this, and check that each other are happy. Not plough on and after go shit I didn't realise she didn't want me - like who wouldn't want me

Don't be daft, you're the one who said there was a lack of evidence. Can't you explain why you think that?

But @Angelsoul2k15uk you have said in your opinion it should not have been brought due to lack of evidence - so I would like to know what that is in your opinion

In the eyes of the law we are all innocent until PROVEN guilty.

Therefore, being found not guilty of a crime means you remain innocent.

That is the law.

I actually hope that some posters here find themselves in court one day accused of a crime they did not commit (a transphobic hate crime would be most apt given the way some seem to want the holding of negative opinions about women by men to be illegal).

Once it reaches the courts, by their own standards the presumption of innocence is lost forever.

What recourse can someone in this situation take ? Pursue the complainant for a malicious allegation ? That would and has also be criticised as disgusting behaviour by feminists.

You seem to want to make it that the only testimony of relevance in a rape case is what a woman says happened on the night in question. Nothing else would be admissible.

Basically you want a system within which a man accused of rape who can be placed at the scene can never prove his innocence. And if he is found not guilty he should just roll over and accept the character assassination and the assertion that the jury and judge are idiots and he is guilty.

These “lads” are an embodiment of the porn generation aren’t they? Exposed to easily accessible denigration of women by multiple men on screen so it becomes only natural to them that they can do the same without consequence. Regardless of the outcome of the case, they left a girl bleeding and hysterical and “threw her home” in the back of a taxi. I hope to god Jackson never pulls on a green jersey again.

@Angelsoul2k15uk in your opinion what evidence would you have liked to have seen before going to trial.

In my opinion it would not have been as high profile as it is now if it had not been take to court. So therefore it was more of a risk taking it. As either way it ended there was going to be people very unhappy. I can't believe the status I am seeing online - right verdict, they are lovely boys. Even if rape is taken out of question, they are far from lovely boys and I would horrified if my daughter was to come home with someone with their mentality about girls - there to be used and abused, a different Belfast slut each night

Ask the jury what the lack of evidence was. Not me

There was more evidence in this case than in the rape case I was juror in and even we were able to agree to convict on one of the counts.

What's the lack of evidence that you see in this case? There seems to have been a lot of evidence, in comparison to some rape cases that go to trial.

What more evidence do you need if injury , victim behaving like a victim and witnesses seeing victim behaving like a victim are not enough? I can't see many rapists writing out written confessions!

confuddledconfuddle It’s not the police who decide to prosecute. Police gather evidence etc and past it on to the public prosecution service. It’s the P.P.S. Who decide.
I also think the police and P.P.S was stuck between a rock and a hard place. Regardless of whether they believed the case was strong or not they would prosecute and lose rather than not prosecute and have all the rape groups/ women’s rights groups etc hammering them because they did not due to it being to famous rugby players.
If it had of been two unknown men the P.P.S would never have taken case to trial in my opinion due to lack of evidence.

No you can conditionally consent to sex.

You can consent to one act but not another. You can consent to sex with one person but not having their friend join. You can put all types of conditionality on your consent.

The unpaid prostitute does not have legal protection because the system is crap but she's still either been raped, robbed or both.

I've just read the text messages in the press and I don't care if they were found not guilty these "men" (and I use the term lightly) show themselves to be vile over egoed pathetic selfish little arseholes in their view of women and their own right to sexual contact from those.

If anyone is on twitter could you tweet to @IrelandMichael
and @jeanHatchet and let them know @sashh is blocked

My only wish is the girl/victim finds the....

Woman. For god sake. She is a WOMAN.

Fuck, having an exchange on twitter and they have blocked my account

Also to the poster who mentioned about the girl who called rape in bessbrook and it was found out to be a lie by the police.

You have made a perfect point. The police investigated it and found out it was a lie. The police investigated this case and believed the girl and thought there was a strong enough case to prosecute - or else it would never have got to trial.

On different note: Jackson's lawyer was guy who defended April jone murderer -, doesn't care how he makes his money. No morals

My only wish is the girl/victim finds the support and love she is seeking and can move on from this.
This may anger some but I also wish the same for the rugby players. Forgiveness is the answer. Forgiveness give you the victim the power back. Forgiveness sets you free

What is 'taking advantage' if it's not rape?

I think this constitutes maybe making the other party feel like you are more interested in a relationship than you are, extra flattery and kindness prior to the act - afterwards discarding them as they have served their purpose. Not technically rape because the act of sex was consented to. You cannot conditionally consent to sex. For example an unpaid prostitute has not technically been raped because agreed to the act of sex.

Yes that makes perfect sense angel, rather than suffer a little regret at having sex with a couple of men, the woman put herself through over 18 months of hell, had to relive the ordeal over and over, in minute detail, to complete strangers when reporting to police, went through examinations which are very invasive, sat through a 9 week trial, knowing rape trials are notoriously difficult for the victim, where she was on the stand for 8 days and had every aspect of her personal life and character called into question, had her underwear passed around, subjected to scrutiny from thousands of people who say she must be 'crying rape'. Why is it so hard to believe women are raped??? Yes of course she chose the latter just to make herself feel better WTF!

www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/inside-court-12-the-complete-story-of-the-belfast-rape-trial-1.3443620?mode=amp

This gives a great summary of the trial.

I would be interested to know what juror said as well.

The jurors comments have been removed, it's being investigated apparently, unbelievable thing to do, even if you do feel the need to explain to people why you came to the decision you did.

There's a big difference in some provocative photos you've posted yourself and some very explicit sexual photos.

Sorry, wasn’t Irish Times, it was Broadsheet.ie. I’m intrigued as apparently she explained why the deliberations were so short.