Was Greer Right When She Said Men Hate Women?

However one thing is that it usually starts in adolescence, so I'm not sure which power structure any adolescent has access to.

Er the patriarchal power structure affects everyone, adults and children. Children are socialised into gender roles from birth basically.

I’d rather be bitched about than subjugated.

I don't think you are being very honest if your saying female-female hostility doesn't exist.

I am sure it does. And women can be misogynists too. However, women do not perpetrate 90% of the violence against other women. Women do not murder 2 women per week. It suits men fine if we just focus on low level bickering between women. That just reinforces that men are better, more rational, more suited for certain jobs etc. Perfect.

Backette- perhaps. However one thing is that it usually starts in adolescence, so I'm not sure which power structure any adolescent has access to.

Men are violent to assert dominance over males and females. They are aggressive to females sometimes because of sexual motivations. I don't think it's as simple as "hate"- which suggests to me a strong dislike

Based on these findings, girls do seem to use relational aggression more than boys.

Think of why that might be. When you’re denied access to the real power structure you can only do minor things like bitching.
Why do you think the trope of the hellish matriarch MIL comes from? Or the endless cycle of Indian daughter in law abuse? Because that’s the only power women had - in the domestic sphere. They can’t kick anywhere else so they kick their fellows.

No but relational aggression has been studied and is mostly female against females

I think personal experience is never going to be good indicator of what is happening on a global scale is it?

Lettuce I could easily find you a scientific reference or you perhaps you could research it- are you saying it's a lie?
To ask the question do men hate women, without looking at female-female hostility as well is to come to a half baked conclusion- which often leads to a type of lie because a half truth isn't the truth.
I'm not disputing the fact that males are physically violent to females. They're also physically violent to men. The majority of assault statistics are male on male

• should we therefore come to the conclusion that men hate men?

Missymoo100

Wikipedia does not count as valid research! The majority of posters on this thread have told you that their experience is not the same as yours but you continue to correlate your experience with other women. This is very clearly your issue, in all my 49 years I have experienced 1 female foe and MANY male ones. But none of that matters......male to female violence is very well documented, fact!

direct physical aggression is more common among boys and indirect aggression is more common among girls. In another study by Baldry[22] it was found that boys are more likely to engage in bullying behaviors such as threats, physical harm, rejection, and name-calling, while girls are most likely to use name-calling, teasing, rumors, rejection, and taking personal belongings. Based on these findings, girls do seem to use relational aggression more than boys.

I don't think you are being very honest if your saying female-female hostility doesn't exist. Likewise how does your personal experience invalidate mine?

Well what I have described is called relational aggression it's been studied scientifically and is more common in females,
So while men are more physically aggressive, social/relational aggression is attributed to females.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Relational_aggression

I no longer give a shit whether this fact makes men uncomfortable. It's a male problem and if they don't want to face that reality, they're part of the problem

Wisdom comes with experience, knowledge and intelligence. I agree totally Chief

I too no longer give a shit.

So your assertion of these male and female behaviors being universal are based on your experiences in spite of evidence to the contrary? Excellent.

I have, in my long career experience, found the opposite of you Missy, having had a few jobs myself.

A few years ago I would have said no. The older I get, the more I understand exactly where Greer is coming from. I think of all the times I have been threatened/groped/put down/talked over/bullied/made to feel uncomfortable and guess what? All male. Obviously NAMALT however the fact is men commit murder, violent crimes and sex crimes at a higher rate than women and the vast majority of those crimes committed against women are by men.

I no longer give a shit whether this fact makes men uncomfortable. It's a male problem and if they don't want to face that reality, they're part of the problem

Thebewilderness- I have in my experience found the opposite to be true having had a few jobs

I think if men dislike one another- they are likely to confrontational. If women don't like each other they form cliques and bitch
Having worked in a male dominated field as well as a female dominated field I can attest that back biting and forming cliques is much more common among men than women.
Calling it guy stuff and boys clubs doesn't change the fact that they are forming cliques and bitching.

Ten years ago I think I’d have said no.

Now, I think she’s right. I’ve heard too many ‘really nice guys’ say things that I’ve found very troubling and seen too many things from casual abuse to really terrible behabiour in life, to truly horrific on the news.

Some men of my acquaintance were talking last year in my earshot and the question of ‘if you absolutely would never get caught would you...?’ Came up. Started off quite silly with trivial things, then into criminality.

More of them (I think 11/13) said yes to rape than murder. It truly chilled me. Because that means the urge is there suppressed only by consequence. I think even our western and law abiding society runs on a thin veneer of vey dark urges. Fuck knows what it’s like where there’s no rule of law (incidentally an excuse trotted out by oxfam -‘ working in places with no rule of law’ what about your innate morality you fuckers??)

And no, I’m sure not every single male of the planet is in a state of fuming rage towards women. I’m sure some genuinely love them. However I think those men are a minority.

Ugghh, I give up- it wasn't in reference to that, it was intended as what I said

What gives anyone the right to say to a school child 'nice tits love'

It's as abhorrent as f***g

Up a bit late-
For goodness sake, I'm not talking about your example- the thread doesn't revolve around you

well if you want to look at inequality in the workplace then yes women can be an obstacle to other women.
How can you determine if men hate women without looking at the other variable, the comparison?