Tamsin sutherland

Lack of critical thinking is so deeply ingrained that two STEM students I know believe that it is biologically possible to change sex.

instant, STEM students at what stage of education and which science(s), if any?

AngryAttackKittens, I’ve realy enjoyed reading your posts on this thread.

Joe, if the OP was genuinely wanting to save us from our own stupidity, it would’ve been better to take a less bonkers-sounding line.

Even if it was the case that he'd been banned, women are in fact allowed to have conversations without men being involved.

Hear, hear. I don't think anyone has the power to ban anyone else here do they? T seems pretty internet savvy I'm sure he knows that talk guidelines exist.

It's nearly 11 pm in the UK so I suspect you'll be waiting a while for your demands to be met, even if you were to make them in a way more likely to get a result than posting goady comments in this thread.

Would mumsnet care to deny t is banned and no platformed by them?

How do you know T was banned? There's been nothing posted in this thread to indicate that. So if you know something that nobody else here does that's interesting information in terms of where you acquired said information.

Even if it was the case that he'd been banned, women are in fact allowed to have conversations without men being involved.

Sorry, are you accusing me of trolling?

T got banned and cannot even defend their position.

(Sigh)

I suspect that someone must have sent out the bat signal to some sort of right wing blog, and now we're going to have a troll invasion.

T has been banned and locked out, Frog. With no right to reply or defend their position.

Political Islam and the regressive Marxist left make unlikely bedfellows but they DO walk hand in hand. The former cannot abide the latter because they are atheists, but at the moment each serves the other's purpose.

Or maybe it's a better tactic than invading countries, inventing stories about WMD, and really horrific acts of terrorism. They do make unlikely bedfellows, especially after the Charlie Hebdo attack, but maybe that's come from a need for forgiveness and understanding rather than a conspiracy.

If anyone out there can come up with any other reason that connects Political Islam with Political Postmodernism and Cultural Marxism, I'm all ears - but I've searched for two years, ad it's the only thing that I have turned up that explains why the two walk hand in hand and want to incarcerate you if you dare speak out.

Well said, Tamsin. Political Islam and the regressive Marxist left make unlikely bedfellows but they DO walk hand in hand. The former cannot abide the latter because they are atheists, but at the moment each serves the other's purpose.

Unless Mumsnet quietly did so behind the scenes and didn't note that in this thread, in which case it would be fascinating to know how you knew about it, Joe.

Nobody has been banned. Do try to keep up.

Lack of critical thinking is so deeply ingrained that two STEM students I know believe that it is biologically possible to change sex. Not only that but this is in no way challenged by their lecturers.

I have been watching a lot of Jordan Peterson lately. It's all very worrying

Well nice bunch you lot are. He is banned, but the thread kept up, so y'all can put the boot in while he had no way to defend himself.

And he is right about the links between Islam and trans agendas. Educate yourselves instead of using that liberal kneejerk reaction to kick a person while they are clearly suffering and wanting some good to come out of it.

AngryAttackKittens I feel the same - it makes sense and I could see how it would be to the benefit of wealth corporations/ individuals but I am unsure about whether it was a deliberate ploy or as you said an unintended consequence.

Sorry I'm tired. I meant to add that this would work to the advantage of wealthy corporations who wish to exploit people - something we can't deny already goes on. While it may sound a little out there to think there is something shadowy and sinister behind this it all moved a bit too fast and with such power for such a 'marginalised' group - so something powerful is behind it. Lets face it a fair few of the more extreme TRAs out there couldn't possible organise all this alone through their craziness. Another thing I am always struck by is the predominance of TIMs in IT - a sector which could wield a great deal of influence.

I think that making it difficult or impossible to clearly define membership in a group makes it hard to enforce any kind of equalities legislation, and am trying to figure out of this is one of the goals of whoever is providing the money/pressure behind the scenes or just an unintended consquence that they either don't care about or are delighted with.

I mentioned a podcast earlier about the money behind the trans movement and I'm paraphrasing (a lot) here but one thought was that this paves the way for trans race and other such ideas and when you take away people's identities like that and make them a free for all you make it impossible for the oppressed to organise as a group and protest against their treatment, so this goes for LGB, Black Lives Matter, women's movements and any other group oppressed by virtue of being born a certain way. What this means is oppressed workers here and in other countries would be unable to group together under such banners and oppose ill treatment. I don't know how much truth there is in that but it did strike a cord since we are currently in a position where women are becoming afraid to have women only meetings or are having such meetings or safe spaces considered exclusive and somehow wrong/immoral.

Great post GuardianLions at Tue 06-Feb-18 13:55:17

This is all part and parcel of obliterating the individual (male & female), their biology and their relationship to their children. Already gender identity surgery has increased in Holland in younger and younger people.

T said: “I simply don't think that kids should be indoctrinated in any way shape or form, it does them all a disservice - and last years Teen Vogue article encouraging anal sex in girls seems clear to me that they seek to switch the primary erotic target from genitalia to the anus, we all have one after all, and that alone would turn everyone kinda gay. Eugenics. That's what this all is in my opinion, and I don't agree with it. There is a definite agenda, it's postmodernism, and it's a clear and present threat to society.”

I agree, there is an agenda. First, they dumbed down State education; afterall it takes only approx 3 or 4 generations to produce a family in which no one knows very much. That helped to cause a lack of critical thinking. The muddying of gender and the early sexualisation of children is deliberate. We are being mixed up thru mass immigration, scaring women off the streets as per Cologne and now via this issue; personally I see the connection. Also, it seems that the importance and protection of mothers towards their children is being eroded, because afterall it is the woman who would fight tooth and nail for the mind and life of her child. So let’s undermine her biological standing by having lots of quasi women. Oh, and dont call mothers mothers because that will offend the new women who have no uterus and the wrong set of chromosomes.

I am very conscious of the fact that people consciously being PC about both Islam and Transgenderism is both harming women's rights and justifying poor attitudes towards and treatment of women.

YY, GuardianLions.

I think it's useful to make a distinction between "wrong" and "evil", and that we're going to have a hard time working with people to get this issue resolved without making that distinction.

That's another point in the "not a grass roots movement" box, the fact that it did take so many people by surprise. Look at the fight for gay marriage for example, it was no surprise to anyone when that came to the point of legal changes being made because it had been openly discussed and worked on for years.

Here's the thing though. Lots of otherwise sensible people think we are raging, pitchfork-wielding terfs out to smash everyone trans. And not being prepared to listen and understand where we are coming from is what is stopping an open debate. I personally think Breitbart is hateful. But people are reading if, and ignoring what they are saying doesn't help anyone. I decided to start widening my media goggles after Brexit. Echo chambers aren't healthy.