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Original poster

Is "cis" the future ?

238 replies

matt1978 · 01/02/2018 04:43

I will admit to being new to the topic and still reading but many threads on here have lead me to further reading. I don't think I've ever bothered with the whole feminist thing until now when I see it being threatened by the trans agenda. Im starting to now feel much more protective about women's rights perhaps it's because I'm older or perhaps in my lifetime there's never been a threat to it ? I'm fearful to say even that for being accused of transphobia and I have no issue at all with anyone living their life as they wish - but I have a daughter and am now fearful for the future - will she have safe women only spaces ? Possibly not. Will she have to call herself a cis woman rather than just a woman ?
I dislike the agenda that you cannot debate or disagree or you're a bigot . It seems so backwards and confusing
I feel ignorant about what's going on out there and would love some insight from better informed posters here .

OP posts:
Original poster
matt1978 · 03/02/2018 05:09

But angry I don't get how the people using this label (as a slur against people who identify the same way that they do?) differentiate themselves from this group (of what seems to me to be the "true" and legit / original group who consider themselves and live as trans ? What makes this new group better and (obviously what they think) "more real"?
I feel like my brain is about to explode !

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AngryAttackKittens · 03/02/2018 04:43

"Truscum" are trans people who experience dysphoria about their bodies and want to change how their bodies look to alleviate it, ie. the group of people who used to be referred to as transsexuals. Lovely term, isn't it? Certainly tells you a lot about the people who use it.

Original poster
matt1978 · 03/02/2018 04:28

And the likes of Munroe B at the recent women's march has fucking infuriated me. MN again lead me to her Twitter - her posts smack of narcissism, arrogance, ignorance and they're totally contradictory. And she has a huge platform which is just bonkers.
"Not all women have reproductive systems, not all women have a vagina, not all women's vagina's are pink. Think about your message, use your voice for ALL women. Not just yourself." Bloody hell !!

Forgive me for making sweeping statements but it seems people like MB are part and parcel of the "look at me", "anything for likes and follows" culture of social media that is so prevalent today.
Anyone can literally say anything, create a meme with a true sounding statement or statistic and post it on social media and there's sadly a huge population who believe anything they read online to be true - they share share share - and suddenly it becomes true. "All my social media friends are saying I should think this way and anyone that doesn't is wrong and evil and should be hunted down? Ok then that's what I'll think."

But if you asked most of those people to articulate an argument for their way of thinking (or justify what they are posting about) I believe that many would be unable too because they've done no independent research . They're sheeple but to me what's scary is they're the majority (or so it seems to me).

It's like an Orwellian nightmare/ the crucible come to life

Is it mostly a younger demographic supporting the LM / MB beliefs ? I'm just curious.

Sorry for the rant.

OP posts:
Original poster
matt1978 · 03/02/2018 04:14

olennas who do they refer too as "true scum"?
More questions if I may! And thank you for your time and patience!
How long has this been going on? Has it been bubbling for years without my noticing ? To me it's only just come to my attention. Perhaps because I'm only around a year into MN which I probably read more than MSM these days.
I just don't see much about it being reported anywhere mainstream. Is that due to the fear of the terf label which creates the pandering, allowing this to grow and grow?
It's not being discussed in my circles in any way. I know that it's not something I'd bring up with friends because you never know if your beliefs differ and again comes the fear of the bigot label. But also - it's not something that has been a topic with my friends. Maybe it should be. I wonder if most of them are as unaware as I have been and perhaps it's my duty to ask them if they are aware of what's happening and how it is a threat ?
After initially posting this the other day and having read many of your replies I spoke to my DH at length about it and he is also is boggled about it although admittedly in a more distant "hmm that's interesting" way !

I've never been someone who is "politicized" or "activist" (for want of better terms) and honestly (don't judge me I know I probably live in a privileged bubble) this may be the first "social" issue I've really felt strongly about in my belly enough to educate myself so fully about.

OP posts:
AngryAttackKittens · 03/02/2018 02:56

"Cis" is nonsense. It's an attempt to shift women to the sidelines of the social category "woman" so that men who "identify" as women can take over, and it's very much part of the backlash against feminism.

OP, we really need the good men who see this for the nonsense that it is and who fear what it means for the women and girls in their lives to back us up on this. Your voice is heard more loudly than ours are, and you're harder to shut up when you put your head above the parapet. So please, speak up, or your daughter will end up with less rights than your grandmother had.

thebewilderness · 03/02/2018 02:37

Here are a few more. gendertrender.wordpress.com/category/sports/

thebewilderness · 03/02/2018 02:22

www.stickybottle.com/latest-news/biological-male-dominates-womens-cycling-event-in-historic-first/

These stories of males who self declare and then sweep women's events are becoming commonplace. Meanwhile trans identified females make to news for having babies.

OlennasWimple · 03/02/2018 02:21

matt - you ask a great question: who is behind this? (And who benefits?)

Personally, I don't think it's a coincidence that LM is receiving very strong support from Momentum, the hard left group that is pursuing a particularly nasty agenda against a number of factions in the Labour Party.

In terms of how TRAs view other non-militant trans people, google "tru scum", which is the lovely label that TRAs append to them. Angry

thebewilderness · 03/02/2018 02:05

Far as I know Madigan is a fully intact male who simply identifies as trans. The same strategy is being used in politics as has been successful in sports. If they are at a disadvantage competing against men they can now identify as a woman and compete as one.
Some feel that it is unfair to the women who have not used drugs like testosterone to improve their performance to have the rules changed so males cay use hormones and compete as women. In my opinion that is only one of the many ways in which prioritizing males in women's sports and politics is unfair.

Original poster
matt1978 · 03/02/2018 01:46

So bewilderness where does lily madigan and her ilk fit in to this ? Is lily fully transitioned (sorry if I'm using incorrect terms) as in had surgery etc ? What about munroe bergdorf?

And are those such as named above judging of other trans groups with different beliefs etc ?

Thanks just learning and trying to understand how all the players fit

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thebewilderness · 03/02/2018 01:18

About thirteen years ago the idea of the trans umbrella was adopted by some in the LGBT community. They did not realize that would mean that AGPs (autogynephile) and MRAs (Men's Rights Activists) would flock to the LGBT communities and demand a leadership role based on winning the oppression olympics then griped that too much attention was being paid to marriage rights and demanded the evicting of gays and lesbians for refusing to have sexual relations with Trans.
It was astonishing to me how rapidly organizations turned against the people who created them and began to promote kinksters instead.

Ereshkigal · 02/02/2018 23:35

I expect they want it all to go away.

Original poster
matt1978 · 02/02/2018 23:24

Could I ask another question please because I've really enjoyed reading all your insight!
Who exactly is behind this extreme movement such as Lily Madigan is part of ? I assume they don't represent the majority of trans people just as Isis don't represent the majority of those who practice Islam for example. Are they just the ones shouting loudest?
So those regular every day trans folk who are just quietly going about their day to day lives - what are their views on all of this ? Do they support or are they against it etc ?
What do THEY really want in terms of rights etc ?
Thanks

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thebewilderness · 02/02/2018 21:49

I am a human woman. I am not an isomer so I am not cis. I have never conformed to the sex roles society dictates and I have suffered for it. This does not make me a trans.
Women are not failed men! Failed men are not women.

WildWindsBlowing · 02/02/2018 21:47

I think I should have said sex rather than gender before.

thebewilderness · 02/02/2018 21:46

I think it important to differentiate between that which we call ourselves and labels applied to us against our will.
Normal is usually used by the mentally ill when discussing and comparing so I think that would be confusing. If you call yourself straight you are referencing your sexuality. If you call yourself normal you are saying something entirely different.
Trans advocates have appropriated intersex language as well as Crenshaws language of intersectionality to promote their interests. In spite of being asked by intersex people and black women not to do so.

Datun · 02/02/2018 21:42

Greendress123

No. Why would they ?

If I need to go for a smear test, I don't expect my surgery to divide that category into straight women's smear tests and gay women's smear tests.

WildWindsBlowing · 02/02/2018 21:41

Identifying, as in identifying rose plant as distinct from a lettuce plant, is different from 'assigning' a rose as a rose rather than 'assigning' it as a lettuce.

So I do not like the word 'assigned' being used the way it is often seems to be used in the context of people's gender.

As I said though I completely see that this word is valid in the context of an intersex child being given a gender.

Greendress123 · 02/02/2018 21:36

Do people who oppose the word cis, also want to drop the word straight in favour of "normal"?

Italiangreyhound · 02/02/2018 21:33

@WildWindsBlowing yes sex is identified or perhaps more accurately observed by anyone present when a baby us born, or sometimes even beforehand!

Ereshkigal · 02/02/2018 20:55

YY it's a reasonable term in the context of intersex people.

WildWindsBlowing · 02/02/2018 20:51

Thank you for explaining Italiangreyhound.
That is a particular case for the use of the word then, where a doctor or parents probably try to decide.

Saying all gender is "assigned" under normal circumstances is not OK imo

Italiangreyhound · 02/02/2018 20:44

I think assigned has come from intersex where a sex was genuinely assigned based on what the person looked like

WildWindsBlowing · 02/02/2018 20:31

I hate "Assigned" as much as "Cis".
It feels 1984ish as though somewhere there is the People's Central Bureau of Assigners.
Who are the assigners?

iamawoman · 02/02/2018 19:47

Excellent post wiggypig - sums up exactly what i detest about the cis label - that and its mostly used by self loathing / loving misogynists

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