Labour’s NEC Set To Confirm Trans People Allowed On All-Women Shortlists

I really want to see a politician explain how they defend the aristocracy exemption. How can it be argued that it's okay to take a gold medal, a scholarship, a sex designated post from women, but not okay to take a dukedom from a man

Something you would imagine Labour to be all over. But their not. Very little about this makes sense to me.

I really want to see a politician explain how they defend the aristocracy exemption. How can it be argued that it's okay to take a gold medal, a scholarship, a sex designated post from women, but not okay to take a dukedom from a man?

What time is this announcement due, do we know?

Whatever you think of Venice, it's not like she's been compiling a spreadsheet of people opposed to her and then encouraging people to report them to the Labour Party and get them banned....

No doubt if she had done so, she'd be in the party still.

Just to let you know that I have been in touch with Jennifer James and they are still very much committed to the original aim of the fundraising. If the decision goes the right way this afternoon and AWS are to be limited to women and transwomen with a GRC they will refund the money - but also look into how to support the 10 (to date) women that are at the receiving end of harassment from the TRAs directly as a result of the fundraising (I have told her that I would be happy for them to use my donation for this purpose instead if indeed the decision goes the right way).

They are holding off updating the GoFundMe page until the decision has been made, but basically, I think the message is, don't worry - we won't be using your money for anything other than the original purpose unless you agree otherwise.

She also asked me to apologise to the amazing Mumsnet people for the state of flux.

(will post on other relevant threads so apologies if you read this repeatedly!)

Churches have protection I'm sure.

Dies anyone know the estimated time we will find out what happens at the NEC? I just might get some work done then

I am just musing something.

What if a male Catholic priest decides to self-ID as a woman? I'm sure that will happen one day. Can the Catholic church kick them out because they do not accept women priests? Even though he's actually a man?

Or what about female Catholics? Can a female Catholic self-ID as a man and apply to the seminary? Would the Catholic church be discriminating against that person if they rejected them?

Obviously this would apply to other religions who exclude women from positions of power.

Exactly - it shows their motives clearly.

But many transitioned people don't want to be on LGBT lists

Tough. We really need to stop pretending that you can actually literally change your biological sex. It's harmful down women, and it's harmful for trans people.

I don't believe Lily has a GRC as you have to have been living as a woman for 2 years and wasn't she only just 20yo last week? Maybe she got it last week but she was saying she had one when she was still 19yo. So I call bullshit.

If we're talking poster girls for the gender Critical movement there could be much better spokeswomen than Venice I agree. Judith Green for instance who has been instrumental in organising A woman's Place and their meetings seems very intelligent and comes across well.

But many transitioned people don't want to be on LGBT lists - they want to be validated by being on women's lists. Note that Lily didn't run for election as an LGBT officer.

Tagging in to keep updated - I too would not be pleased if the fund went to defend VA.

My issue is with self-id. This is what I donated to fight, and I sincerely hope that it still happens. Sitting tight for now.

Surely the fair, progressive solution is to introduce a number of all-LGBT shortlists?

Truth seems to with be a very flexible or a very transphobic concept at the moment.

Oh and they also said they are a woman. Also a vulnerable girl, also a competent politician.

Lily has stated that Lily has a GRC...

True. They have also said they can get pregnant as much as any other woman. They said their brother set up the Twitter account that advocated rape. They said they were asexual. They also said they were a lesbian. And that they were not on the labour against transphobia Facebook page, despite screenshots. Apparently they had been photo shopped. They said they can't afford £24 for UCAS application, and a GRC costs £140.

Lily has stated that Lily has a GRC...

True.

It feels sadly rather apt that the woman known as Rosie the Riveter has just passed away.

We can do it! No we bloody can't. Not as far as Labour are concerned. Women, know thy place

Lily Madigan is not a legal woman

Lily has stated that Lily has a GRC...

I've sent an email to the address on the first update. I'm not on twitter.

I also want my donation to go towards the originally specified aim of no self-ID onto AWS.

'Thinking about transitioning' is only protected under this act as much as any of the other protected characteristics, like your ethnicity, marital status, sexuality and all the others.

Yes, unless people have donated money that they should not have anyway then I suggest that people wait for now before withdrawing. Do let JJ know your views, however.

In terms of the equality act, you are quite right in that it mimics self ID, on the basis of 'even thinking about transitioning is a protected characteristic'.

"Sounds to me that self id is already law then. Would be difficult to keep Lily Madigan off a short list.

We lost in 2004."

Well yes, except as usual, the devil is in the detail.

Lily Madigan is not a legal woman. The shortlists specify woman.

So, for instance, Madigan could not be discriminated against under the equality law.

That is meant to mean denied a job, housing, etc.

Is it discriminating against a man by not allowing him to say he is a woman, even though he legally isn't one?

If he is transitioning, then you could say yes, but then women are also protected on the basis of their sex.

AND there are exemptions to Madigans discrimination. Whether the objections to allow him access to all women's shortlists are a 'proportional means to a legitimate aim'. That is the wording of the exemption.

The legitimate aim would be creating all women shortlists to actually be reserved for women.

I mean I can't see how that exemption isn't entirely applicable.