Labour’s NEC Set To Confirm Trans People Allowed On All-Women Shortlists

Is the meeting still going on?

I think they mean that they want to collect more meaningful data about party members, their backgrounds and the challenges they may face.

Not that you can self-ID into roles that are exclusively for BAME or people with disabilities.

Because they haven't seen that coming yet, the bloody idiots.

That's me getting top rate DLA now I'm disabled, bye bye work

Well I want to self identify as disabled so I can have a blue badge and have more chance of a parking space at work.

They're not having any gatekeeping at all? Even with the disabled identity?

Honestly? What kind of hole are Labour bloody digging for themselves here ffs.

Post by TwoFlames is not a joke. Labour now lets you self ID as female, BAME, and disabled.

Here is the Labour document aliceperry.wordpress.com/2018/01/19/labour-nec-report-16-january-2018/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

Although interestingly the terminology around disability has been like that for quite a long time - it changed from "do you have a disability" to "do you consider yourself to have a disability" ages ago.

That's been a bit blundered into via the Equality Act I think. The legal definition of disability is pretty vague. When tested in court it's been a case it's very difficult to prove not since the terminology looks at the person's subjective perception of 'significant' and their own assessment on the degree of impact on day to day activities, and the pressure has been on services, education, providers and everyone else under Local Government guidance to consider the definition and consider that persons possible qualification for EA protection and provide reasonable adjustments proactively to protect themselves from legal come back.

So it was probably helpful to ask straight out, do you consider yourself to have a disability, and also seen as a more sensitive way to ask than 'are you disabled'. Professionals leading this are usually very passionate about inclusion, disability rights and sensitivity. That's morphing now towards being interpreted as 'do you IDENTIFY' as having a disability with the new shiny legalities around 'identify'.

A mix between mission creep, people trying to be kind and then being afraid of clear boundaries as too harsh, and the road to hell being paved with good intentions.

Sick of MN posting before I am done. try again

There aren't enough people with 'traditional' values for it to be worth their while going backwards on rights issues.

Right issues, besides womens rights of course. WHo cares about the rights of boring old women when you could support male people taking those rights for themselves. Its fine for Labour to go backwards in terms of womens rights, it seems.

Missed the end off my post

I think they'd probs alienate more people by being anti-trans.

Just seen this. I know the thread has moved on, but noone is proposing the party be 'anti-trans'. In what way is anyone wanting anything 'anti-trans' rather than the law to be upheld on womens rights? I doubt anyone at all (besides 'transgender' males who it has to be all 'me me meeeee' with) would mind trans-idenfitied-females being on all female lists. As they are actually female. Which is the aim of the lists in the first place. Would be nice to see some transman representation anyway. Transmen are hugely forgotten about as transactivists have decided that transmen inherit male privelage the second they decide to transition, which is clearly batshit.

So depressing. What we should be seeing are the men presenting in women's traditional garb and behaviour but still standing a trans identifying male candidates so sex not gender as mentioned above already.

And the takeover of labour by shit-for-brained youngsters and inhabitants of Brighton is hereby complete.
As a Tory I should be happy. Strangely, though, I’m not.

that post by two flames is a joke presumably

it changed from "do you have a disability" to "do you consider yourself to have a disability" ages ago

I don't think it is a joke no, I think it's about using the nice inclusive language in your example. The problem is "do you consider yourself disabled" is no different to "do you consider yourself a woman"

I simply don’t trust Labour any more, it may even mean me voting Tory for the first time in my life next GE if they have put the GRA amendments on the back burner.

Am on the edge of my seat waiting to find out whether or not Labour will be transitioning to becoming for the menny and the few.

Love your perfect way with words there

that post by two flames is a joke presumably

Although interestingly the terminology around disability has been like that for quite a long time - it changed from "do you have a disability" to "do you consider yourself to have a disability" ages ago. I think to include people who had invisible disabilities / weren't wheelchair users / didn't have blue badges / weren't sure whether they qualified or not. Not for people without a disability to identify into but I suspect that probably happens. Defining disability can be hard. And is also a bit personal. What one person considers a disability another may not etc

When will the Labour Party start identifying as a good, solid socialist party again?

Very well put Jaimes.

I started out sympathetic to the cause of trans people like most people on here. The more I've read, the sheer levels of misogyny and toxic male entitlement I have come across in the TRA community have changed my position from one of sympathy, through horror and disbelief at what is going on in the trans agenda, through to ultimately, a rejection of it.

I was prepared to move over a bit and share what few resources women have managed to obtain, not any longer. I'm done with being 'understanding' and 'empathetic'.

WTF is happening with the NEC announcement? Am on the edge of my seat waiting to find out whether or not Labour will be transitioning to becoming for the menny and the few.

Agree with the above re: positive narrative.

Just saw this tweet. Could only find the energy to sigh deeply.

^I hear the NEC is entertaining suggestions that disabled people and black people should also 'self-identify' for quota purposes.
You think this is a shit show?
Wait till you see men trying to geg on a list cos their great grandfather once visited Yemen^

JaimesGoldenHand

Excellent post. What you have set out should be the baseline position on 'gender identity' for gender-critical feminists. Instead of just opposing self-ID, we need to challenge the whole basis of trans ideology and its place in law, while setting out a progressive vision for laws that protect all gender-non-conforming people, both trans-identified and not. It's a positive stance and it also helps to shift the Overton Window. Feminists have been on the back foot in this debate for too long.

When did this narrative turn? Is this just a way for homophobic MRAs to crush the feminist and gay rights movements in one fell swoop

I think some people give MRAs too much credit.

I think it's more that they want to just give full rights to gay men and women. People just lump the Trans thing in with gay rights because it's on the end of LGB without giving it a second thought.

Possibly

70s & early 80s was GNC all over the shop not sure what happened.

Backlash I suppose.