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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

ITV Transformation Street

639 replies

RedToothBrush · 11/01/2018 17:29

On tv tonight.

But here's an article to give you a taste of what its going to be like:www.standard.co.uk/lifestyle/london-life/transformation-street-itv-transgender-documentary-a3737876.html

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Deadlylampshade · 21/01/2018 19:17

Meet Travis. Travis is a non binary performance artist who when asked to use the men’s changing rooms in Topshop because teenage girls were getting changed, launched a campaign and Topshop changed their policy so anyone get changed in the women’s changing room. I mean you couldn’t challenge anyone could you in case they turned out to be trans.

ITV Transformation Street
48harv · 21/01/2018 19:12

The law did insist a name change had to be done but then it was only in conjunction with the eventual gender change and it took 4years to change my birth certificates, after the operations and the ownership of a British passport in my new name
How can they loosen the legal requirements if anything they need to be toughened to make it absolutely the final thing that a transgender person goes through lightly all checks should be made to make sure it’s the best thing for the patient, you can call yourself willywonker but you still won’t own a chocolate factory.

Vicxy · 21/01/2018 19:01

I actually don’t think surgery should be a requirement for getting a gender recognition certificate, it’s not appropriate in every case and I tend to think the less invasive surgery the better. Totally think you should get if if you need it though.

I don't see why GRCs are a thing at all. They were originally brought in to counter same sex marriage not being possible, so that transsexual people could marry the same sex. They seem quite..pointless now that we have equal marriage.

48harv · 21/01/2018 19:00

I am sorry if I saw Danielle moscato in a female changing room I would shout the roof down and tell (it) to get out,
I went through years of electrolysis, a five hour operation, a year of intensive pain , a prolapse which happened 3 months after the 1st op I walked around for 9 months with half my new vagina on the outside of my body , because my health council hadn’t paid the bill and they wouldn’t do a 2nd op until paid, then by using some of my lower intestine to repair the vagina ,I lost my figure that I was my pride and joy and gained weight rapidly, I finally managed to reduce my weight but never fully got my figure back, this picture has no feminine traits at all, a change of name is not enough, Now I understand your anger.

Deadlylampshade · 21/01/2018 18:56

I actually don’t think surgery should be a requirement for getting a gender recognition certificate, it’s not appropriate in every case and I tend to think the less invasive surgery the better. Totally think you should get if if you need it though.

I’m happy with the way the process is now, two years, gender dysphoria certificate, and therapy.

However if a trans person keeps their penis they can’t be surprised if lesbians don’t want to sleep with them, or even if they have the surgery by that matter because the surgery doesn’t actually make you female.

Italiangreyhound · 21/01/2018 18:40

@48harv "I wear unisex attire for convenience as doing housework for elderly people in my community these clothes are more suitable, my inner pain was totally reduced after my operations the choice of clothes was no longer an issue as I was finally at peace with myself" this for me suggests clearly for transsexuals that 'gender' not the source of dysphoria, in as much as the physical cultural representation of what is expected for being female. But rather sex, which is not maybe the same as for many who would once have identified as transvestites/cross dressers.

In the trailor for this week's episode of Transformation Street a trans woman says something like I'm not less of a woman for my penis, or words to that affect (it looks like someone famous) and that is one area where I feel really uncomfortable, pretending that that doesn't matter. I can't pretend.

@Vicxy "Note this is not necessarily about transsexual people, but people who 'identify' as 'transgender"

This is such an important thing. I've even heard a trans person write about how someone identifying as trans changes their name! As if that means anything! Like it is not an indicator or anything other than a name change! There could be more to it or less to it. If I had had my body physically altered I would be hopping mad someone else felt they just needed a nane change!

Italiangreyhound · 21/01/2018 18:18

@Deadlylampshade and @Datun great posts this afternoon. Smile very clear and insightful.

@48harv I'm reading your posts. I 've not gone away. Flowers

WaitrosePigeon · 21/01/2018 18:09

Whaaaaaat!

ITV Transformation Street
Datun · 21/01/2018 17:16

I have to go out now but I wanted to say, before I go, how heartening it is to see productive discussion be so effective.

Datun · 21/01/2018 17:15

harv

I'm absolutely delighted you are on side.

I do urge you to write to your MP, send an actual letter. It's a lot harder to ignore these days than email. If you get a bog standard reply back, ask for a meeting. Say you are trans! It's so helpful. Because you have credibility.

The website A woman's Place UK has formulated some points which bear reading. It's about the exemptions that we actually do have under the current law, but they are not being invoked. Either because retailers/service providers don't know about them, or because the wording is very woolly all they are frightened of transactivists.

Advice on letter writing is here.

fairplayforwomen.com/womans-place-uk

But the rest of the website is worth looking at. They are very calm, grown-up women. They don't get involved in slanging matches.

I'm sorry if it might be painful for you to see this conflict. But it's really not about being anti-trans, it's about being pro women.

And women are frightened that all their gains are been taken away.

Making gender dysphoria a cornerstone of being trans is vital. For you and us.

Vicxy · 21/01/2018 17:10

I have scanned your info on the prison issue.. mind bogglingly inept, no wonder you are angry, this is a licence to import sexual assault on a huge scale in what is a captive society sure there are lesbian encounters in a woman’s prison but importing a man , yes a man because if he has not had the corrective surgery he is a man , to allow this to enter a female prison is inconceivable and illogical

Yeah, and this is just a tiny part of whats going on today. Women have a right to be angry. I hope you don't take it personally, which it seems you don't. This is not about individual trans people, its about transactivism and what the extremists are demanding, and getting.

Deadlylampshade · 21/01/2018 17:10

I don’t want your blood pressure to go too high but this is Danielle Muscato who identifies as a woman. This is her after her transition.

ITV Transformation Street
48harv · 21/01/2018 17:09

I am sorry I must go to church time has flown , must go or I will be late

48harv · 21/01/2018 17:07

Well I did ask for some reading material from you and have I got it , I have a bit of catching up to do thank you

48harv · 21/01/2018 17:01

For years I have been looking after me and my main perogative was to be anonymous some things are wirth saying out loud NO THIS IS .WRONG

48harv · 21/01/2018 16:58

I have scanned your info on the prison issue.. mind bogglingly inept, no wonder you are angry, this is a licence to import sexual assault on a huge scale in what is a captive society sure there are lesbian encounters in a woman’s prison but importing a man , yes a man because if he has not had the corrective surgery he is a man , to allow this to enter a female prison is inconceivable and illogical

Deadlylampshade · 21/01/2018 16:50

I think a lot of women would be very happy to see you with that banner harv I know I would be.

Be prepared though you might experience a backlash too.

Deadlylampshade · 21/01/2018 16:48

That’s awful you were attacked, I am very sorry that was your experience and I truly hope that the world can become more tolerant.
As I said earlier my mother was a lesbian and when I was a child we were terrorised by a gang of local kids. They spray painted our house, put fireworks through the window, bricks through the window, just endless abuse, in the end the council moved us.
Though my experience is completely different I can fully empathise with that torment and it’s awful.

It’s my belief that if we didn’t have such strict gender rules then it wouldn’t be so difficult for society to accept people who step outside them.
We are fighting the same fight.

48harv · 21/01/2018 16:47

It’s not law yet we can still stop it if we unite , I will definatly be going to the March on the 8th , with the biggest banner I can carry to shout this is not a fair law

48harv · 21/01/2018 16:41

From that Friday 22 June 1990 I ceased being a man I through out all my male clothes and fortunately had an extensive female wardrobe to fall back on, Then all hell broke loose fir 3 months I was terrorised night and day I put a bucket of water under the letterbox as I feared an arson attack, but this is straying from the issue at hand. I will be writing to all the government figures I can to stop this lunacy

Deadlylampshade · 21/01/2018 16:39

Thanks harv

I’m glad that we’ve come to the same page because when you come on hear it must just seem like we’re screaming about trans women for no reason. It must be very frightening, but we’re not hateful I promise. We just want the best for everyone and our opinions puts us in the firing line for attack so we can sometimes be defensive. If you look on a thread that’s going on right now a woman’s officer in the Labour Party, a 19 year old trans woman, is compiling a list of women she wants thrown out of the party for wanting to debate this law.
Another thread you can see is a go fund me page set up to challenge the Labour Party as they said that ‘anyone who self identifies as a woman’ can take jobs reserved for women. This go fund me page has been phissed and they are trying to ‘out’ the women who donated as transphobes.

It’s really shocking and we’re all quite raw about it. So when a trans woman comes on the forum and tries to show us that they aren’t evil people to be afraid of, we can get very frustrated.

We’re not evil people to be afraid of either. I promise.

Vicxy · 21/01/2018 16:37

Note this is not necessarily about transsexual people, but people who 'identify' as 'transgender'

Vicxy · 21/01/2018 16:36

But why do you equate a man dressing as a woman to that of a sex offender and a threat to your safety? Most offenders of this type are male and wouldn’t be seen dead in a dress,

fairplayforwomen.com/prisons/transgender-prisoners

Heres a good start, if you are genuinely interested. Massively overrepresented.

48harv · 21/01/2018 16:35

There was no certificate back then I was in my own, I took letters I wrote myself to all the shops I used and advised them of what I was doing and that if they objected to me being in their store then I would respect that and look fir an alternative ,I did get a positive response from all the owners

48harv · 21/01/2018 16:32

I also had a hard job donating blood afterwards I had to prove I had not had sex in my past life with a man I have donated 86pints to date and proud if it