Hampstead Heath Women's Pond

There are some very gender critical points that have been made below the line on this article. Apart from the normal inappropriate / unkind comments which plague all btl comments, there are an awful lot of evident 'peak transing' points being made.

Surely trans-identifying people of either sex could use the mixed pool if they just want to swim, and no one would think anything of it? The fact that they're insisting on using the women's pool suggests it's more about making a point and forcing their way into yet another female space. What a shame.

Indeed. Its about eroding female only spaces, nothing more.

Lots of talk of comparing the women's only pool to a men's only golf club

Not the same- there is a men's pool and a mixed pool at Hampstead. You don't change into a costume on a golf club either

The problem with men's only golf clubs was that there was no equivalent space for women AND the major factor being that a lot of business and networking was being conducted in the clubhouse/on the course, from which female colleagues were being excluded - same thing as "client jollies" to strip clubs and the like.

As far as I'm aware, I have never heard women complaining about men-only gyms, men-only bars, men-only saunas etc. But the majority of men do not and would not use these facilities and so have little interest in guarding them, hence feeling free to call women bigots if they want women-only spaces.

It ought to Brighton, that's the thing, extending these rights to TIM's effectively excludes other (much larger) minority groups from those activities/services which are currently single sex. It's astounding that this point is being ignored by those supporting the changes.

Do Muslim women use the pool? I'm wondering if this will result in a lawsuit.

Lots of talk of comparing the women's only pool to a men's only golf club

Not the same- there is a men's pool and a mixed pool at Hampstead. You don't change into a costume on a golf club either.

there is literally no reason for them to ask to go into the women's pond beyond them wanting to.

Yes. People need to wake up to this men's rights agenda. Its not about protection, it's about validation, power and control.

Lots of talk of comparing the women's only pool to a men's only golf club. Completely ignoring the reasoning behind each of these segregated spaces.

Yes the bloke who did the whole Topshop thing doesn't even claim to be a transwoman, he just reckons he is 'gender fluid'. Apparently this means that you wear whatever the fuck you want (great) and also you get access to whatever the fuck space you want, including spaces segregated by sex (not so great)

Regrettably, I think it's only a matter of time before there will be a test case on this. We now seem to be in the position where schools, youth organisations such as the Guides, prisons, hospitals and businesses such as TopShop are all letting boys and men who say they identify as trans or even just as genderfluid, whatever that means, share bedrooms, toilets, bathrooms, showers, tents, wards and changing rooms with girls and women who will in the nature of things be in a state of undress. Nobody seems to give two hoots about how this will make these women feel or the very obvious increased risk of voyeurism and male violence against these women.

If there is some sort of assault that gets a lot of publicity, that might lead to a change in public perception on this. But why on earth should things have to be as bad as that for common sense to prevail?

I actually think there would be outrage if women went to the 'Men's pond'. The very fact that there is a men's pond shows that men want a space away from women and we know how they would not meekly accept females into a male space.

I find their timing of this rule change to be very sly. You only have to look at the posters saying they will protest in warmer weather, to know why it has been picked as the perfect time to change the rules. They know that by the time spring and summer comes around it will be too late for women to protest as it will be over run by Tims, TRAs and perverts. FFS local women, do something NOW as it will be too late in the warmer weather.

MiMi78
I don't know. I think if it relates to children - so a girl being assaulted in a school changing room by a self id boy "I am now a girl" then a school would be vulnerable under safeguarding rules but how any of this would translate into an actual court case I wouldn't know?
The dilemma is that there needs to be case law that teases this out and I understand that law firms are very reluctant to take this on type of work. The dangers of being called 'transphobic' are a real problem for everyone working in the law, politics, education, health (well anywhere really).
I think it will change soon - if only because the press are finally reporting it openly so the TG activists lose their ability to define anyone challenging as transphobic. Once the general population is discussing whether it is OK to have men with autogynephilia sharing changing rooms with their daughters, maybe some law firms might start shifting their stance on this.

Yes Ursula. What is your point?

The Equality Act protects sex, race and religion.
Not discriminating against trans people based on their trans status does not mean erasing other peoples rights.

Surely all women should have the same rights?

Does anyone know if there would be any sort of Legal liability for institutions letting TIMS in as if the GRA has already come into play, if a woman was attacked, harassed etc at a sex segregated area?
This isn't my area of knowledge at all, so there maybe an obvious answer. I've googled and can't find anything.

This is how the TG groups have made such progress so quickly. Funded by the government and promoting their own versions of the law and ideas - and it's being accepted as fact by employers / organisations

Completely agree with this. Employers are accepting these perverted versions of equality guidance as if they are law without challenge - and imposing the outcomes on employees - who will be branded as bigots if a voice is raised in arguement!
Totally depressing and I foresee it getting much worse this year.

TheXXFactor thanks for the protest link.
They are in breach of the Equality Act. Religion, race and sex are all protected characteristics, and there are already 2 other ponds trans or gender fluid people can use.

Why should rich white women have fewer rights than everyone else?

Hahaha haha haha haha.

Bravo. You almost had me there

Furious

Yes, had this point on the trans nurse thread yesterday about how bigoted women are and if they replaced "trans" with "black" they'd realised.

This is not about treating a group of society with hatred and intolerance - it's about allowing the most harassed and assaulted section of society a space where they can participate in healthy activity without fear, no matter what their colour or creed.

"Liberal" men are really throwing women of all races and faiths under the bus.

MiMi78
Where is the liberal stance when our Muslim, Hasidic, religious women are having another space shut to them due to their culture.

Exactly. They also have the nerve to compare women only spaces to white supremacists

Agreed Spartacus.
It's infuriating!

Surely when there is a gender neutral oprion trans people should use it? I could u derstand if there was only a men's pond and a ladies' pond and transwomen felt like they couldn't use the men's pond but there is literally no reason for them to ask to go into the women's pond beyond them wanting to.

Where is the liberal stance when our Muslim, Hasidic, religious women are having another space shut to them due to their culture

Yes, but as soon as white skinned "middle class" women start making demands for different things they will be put in their places / reminded by their woke liberal and.or socialist brothers of the relative position of the exact same other women who will not be able to use the pond and told to be intersectional and put other women's needs first.