Does anyone feel the need to reclaim femnism.....?

Handmaiden is a ridiculous catch-all term... It is used to ridicule a woman you don't agree with.

I agree with you there Lass, and as a gendered insult for behaviour that is not exclusive to women I find it deeply misogynistic.

I first heard handmaiden here. In the old days I think the term was 'cocksucker'. If anyone can be bothered the American feminist Mary Daly spent some energy discussing women who fucked over other women for male approval. The opposite was 'womyn identified womyn' from memory.

My reason for starting this thread was realizing that I would not be at all surprised if absolutely nothing changes after the Pussy March/Weinstein/#metoo events. Everything will just settle back down the way it was before with very little if any change

My reason (well one of them) for avoiding twitter is that it it allows for clicktivsm and catharsis but usually changes very little, especially in terms of entrenched sexism. Some men will be exposed and vilified (sacrificial lambs) and life will go on as normal for most.

Yes. Sorry Bertrand.

Must stop throwing the fucking fish for them.

I did make a nice quiche earlier if that's more relevant? Blind baked the pastry and everything...

Actually that's not right is it. The handmaiden does have the potential for a kind of subversive power but only through a resistant will.

No obviously but Margaret Atwood didn't change its meaning. The handmaiden is powerless

I meant when it started to be used by some feminists to insult/define other women.

Certain, when did it start being used?

I think the Oxford English dictionary will be your etymological helpmeet here.

We're not suggesting that Margaret Atwood invented the word are we?

From wiki, as I'm not a bible expert!

"Rachel, like Sarah and Rebecca, remained unable to conceive. According to Tikva Frymer-Kensky, "The infertility of the matriarchs has two effects: it heightens the drama of the birth of the eventual son, marking Isaac, Jacob, and Joseph as special; and it emphasizes that pregnancy is an act of God."[5]

Rachel became jealous of Leah and gave Jacob her maidservant, Bilhah, to be a surrogate mother for her. Bilhah gave birth to two sons that Rachel named and raised (Dan and Naphtali). Leah responds by offering her handmaid Zilpah to Jacob, and names and raises the two sons (Gad and Asher) that Zilpah bears. According to some commentaries, Bilhah and Zilpah are actually half-sisters of Leah and Rachel.[6] After Leah conceived again, Rachel was finally blessed with a son, Joseph,[3] who would become Jacob's favorite child."

Historically, a handmaid is just a lady's maid, isn't it?

Though there are many specific bible references re handmaidens. Leah, Rachel, Sarah are the women with handmaidens that spring to mind

Yes Irk I do.

Certain, when did it start being used?

The term handmaiden existed before the handmaid's tale though. I've never linked the two. Surely a handmaid is someone who caters to your every whim? 'You' being 'the patriarchy'.

Things will change, just in baby steps. I hope.

@BertrandRussell nothing will change.Well not significantly anyways , or anything more than surface level.
The hope is that things will change eventually .

Sorry I'm probably not making any sense.

I'm inclined to agree with you there Bertrand. There is no shift in power so we revert to the status quo. I do feel that women turning on each other in the #metoo campaign is contributing to its imminent demise though

DioneTheDiabolist
Do you think that TERF is misogynistic?

Irk, I agree it is not misogynistic to call women out on their misogyny. Gendered insults coined specifically for use against women are misogynistic.

Yes Edna, the Handmaiden were victims. In the Handmaiden Tale, the system was facilitated more by Wives, Aunt's and Marthas rather than Handmaids which makes its modern usage even more incomprehensible.

A handmaiden is a woman who uses misogynistic behaviour against another women. Its not always unknowing. It can be deliberate and intentional.

As a description it may be considered insulting by the recipient. But its not misogynistic to call women out on their misogyny.

I detest the term Handmaiden, and will continue to challenge it's use

Good for you. I'll continue to use it when I feel it's appropriate as I can't think of a better term to communicate that behaviour. And will continue to challenge tone policing, concern trolling and being made to walk on eggshells.

But the Handmaids in the Handmaids Tale were all victims surely. And isn't the woman who serves her husband unquestioningly a victim too? I agree that both men and women reinforce mysogyny unknowingly but it doesn't serve the women so I don't think it's fair to use gendered slurs against them. Neither sex workers who say it's a vocation.