Active discussions

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

Original poster

What happens when the Scouts outsources its policy writing to Mermaids?

64 replies

pisacake · 03/12/2017 20:16

It's as mad as you'd expect.

members.scouts.org.uk/supportresources/4228/gender-identity-supporting-young-people?cat=377,378&moduleID=10

"Gender identity issues do not just affect adults; children even as young as 2 years old can be diagnosed with ‘gender dysphoria’ or ‘gender identity disorder’."

Start em young!

"The young person has a right to be treated as their true gender irrespective of what stage they are at. "

where true gender presumably means their 'trans' gender, because nobody ever ever changes their mind, right?

Disabled toilets are a no-go, sorry they are trans toilets now :

"refer to and label toilets appropriately (e.g. ‘unisex/accessible toilets’ rather than ‘disabled’)"

Binding your breasts is completely normal and harmless

"Young people who are developing breasts may strap down their chest, to make it less obvious. This is called ‘binding’ and it is important to respect the young person’s decision to do this."

"If you have young people who are binding their chests, monitor them carefully during particularly physical activities (such as rock climbing) and hot temperatures. There is a chance that the binding could cause discomfort or even impair breathing, and it may be necessary to subtly offer more breaks."

Wonder what the protocol is if you collapse because you can't fucking breathe? Is it transphobic to remove the binder?

Girls and boys toilets also transphobic

"Wherever possible, select a venue that has unisex toilet facilities "

Always prioritise the feelings of the trans person above everyone else.
"There is no rule in Scouting stating that young people must be split by gender for sleeping arrangements. "
"Sharing with other young people of their true gender (or their biological sex if they would prefer), either in large or small tents with their trusted friends."

members.scouts.org.uk/supportresources/4227

"What causes it?
The most recent scientific research suggests that it is strongly associated with the development of the brain in the womb."

Hmm, do the Scouts have a biology badge?

members.scouts.org.uk/supportresources/4229

"People who are transgender have a right to be treated as their acquired gender, regardless of what (if any) medical or legal steps they have taken. "

WRONG. They have a right not to be discriminated against, except where lawful.

"You do not need to ask for proof for their records to be altered (e.g. to show their Gender Recognition Certificate).
"

Yeah who needs to bother with silly paperwork, it's not like record keeping is important or anything, amirite?

OP posts:
Original poster
pisacake · 04/12/2017 19:51

Hand out leaflets on how babies can be transgender too?

OP posts:
LangCleg · 04/12/2017 17:26

Quite aside from the adult/child safeguarding issues, what are Scouts and/or Guides going to do when someone's daughter comes home from a camping trip having got pregnant?

Lancelottie · 04/12/2017 17:22

A room marked TERFs, huh? Starting to sound perfect to me. It can stand for Totally Excellent Restroom Facilities.

Bit American, but the best I can do.

Miranda and other equally TERF-y transwomen can come in as usual.

DamsonGin · 04/12/2017 15:46

As a former scout leader, I can't quite sum up the words to express my level of wtf at this.

Gileswithachainsaw · 04/12/2017 15:02

Bloody hell

Why Can't there just be guidelines in plave to just allow all the members to just be who they are and celebrate that without it meaning there's something wrong with them.

Why are we encouraging this with kids so much so that we allow them to risk even being able to breathe just to fall over ourselves to be politically correct.

Why part of roaming through woods building camp fires and playing games requires breasts or a penis? It's all "neutral" surely?

Leave them alone and stop making them share personal spaces with the opposite sex to prove a point.

Poor kids Sad

Sentimentallentil · 04/12/2017 14:58

Oh god that link.

What the actual fuck?

Trans people are not intersex for gods sake.

Surely if that’s true then scientists could just do a test to see where we were on the ‘sex spectrum’ or whatever guff they call it and then we could all go home.

CertainHalfDesertedStreets · 04/12/2017 14:55

What if there's a load of trans identified boys who want to share with the girls (their "true gender ") and a load of trans identified girls who want to share only with their biological sex?

Any girls who want to share only with their biological sex will be spirited away to the special room marked 'TERFS' so I can't imagine that being a popular option...

Original poster
pisacake · 04/12/2017 14:50

is Transas City transascity.org/the-transgender-brain/

It co-opts a whole bunch of intersex conditions to fraudulently imply a link to transgender.

OP posts:
Original poster
pisacake · 04/12/2017 14:48

I googled it. Top hit

OP posts:
PencilsInSpace · 04/12/2017 14:47

What is the law?
Gender reassignment is a protected characteristic under the Equality Act 2010, whether or not the person is undergoing medical treatment. This means that as with ‘disability’, organisations have a duty to make reasonable adjustments to ensure that trans Members can access Scouting, including anticipating the needs of any future members.

FFS they're just making it up as they go along!

The term 'reasonable adjustments' only applies to the protected characteristic of disability. There's a lot said about RA in the equality act and all of it - every single paragraph and sub paragraph relates to people with disabilities and nobody else.

JessicaEccles · 04/12/2017 14:35

The most recent scientific research suggests that it is strongly associated with the development of the brain in the womb."

Incredible. WHAT EVIDENCE? WHAT RESEARCH? where is their citation? the peer reviews?

Sometimes I think Cordelia Fine should be required reading for every single person before they make stupid fucking proclamations on gender.

GinevraFanshawe · 04/12/2017 13:32

What if there's a load of trans identified boys who want to share with the girls (their "true gender ") and a load of trans identified girls who want to share only with their biological sex?

What if the boys are happy to share with trans boys but feel uncomfortable with a trans girl or vice versa? You literally can't have it both ways.

bananasaregood · 04/12/2017 13:11

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

AstraiaLiberty · 04/12/2017 13:05

How are the two statements on tent sharing not directly contradictory? How can you reconcile a preference for sharing with others of one's "true gender" with a competing preference for sharing with one's "biological sex"?

I think it means that the feelings of the trans person take priority. They can choose whichever tent they prefer, biological sex or 'true gender.' Any other young person who might feel uncomfortable sharing with them is of course a transphobic bigot and should be ignored.

SlowlyShrinking · 04/12/2017 12:54

Binding/assignment of gender rules to toddlers etc? Who have they got running help desk, Jimmy Savilles apprentice? Oh wait

I’m torn between laughing and crying at this. You really couldn’t make it up, could you?!

Scabbersley · 04/12/2017 12:44

If using the accessible/disabled toilet is the young person’s preferred option, refer to and label toilets appropriately (e.g. ‘unisex/accessible toilets’ rather than ‘disabled’)

huh? So what about disabled people? How come trans people are allowed to just take over their loos Confused

TheCountessofFitzdotterel · 04/12/2017 12:40

The phrase 'true gender' makes me rage. It is a religious belief, that the organisation appears to have adopted with no consultation or discussion.

Mrsfrumble · 04/12/2017 12:31

How are the two statements on tent sharing not directly contradictory? How can you reconcile a preference for sharing with others of one's "true gender" with a competing preference for sharing with one's "biological sex"?

Am I missing something here?

birdbandit · 04/12/2017 11:42

I wouldn't trust any organisation, whether it be the scouts or a school, with the welfare of my children, if they are this demonstrably lacking in critical thinking skills. If they are so easily influenced by child abusers.

Binding/assignment of gender rules to toddlers etc? Who have they got running help desk, Jimmy Savilles apprentice? Oh wait....

SchnooSchnoo · 04/12/2017 11:23

There is literally nothing a two-year-old could do to make me question their ‘gender identity’. I don’t understand this at all! How can anyone with half a brain cell believe this bollocks?

DamnItall · 04/12/2017 11:21

What @ZooeyAndFranny said x 10000

hipsterfun · 04/12/2017 10:40

...a mother who defied NHS rules and took her child abroad to be castrated...

Can anyone explain - or point me to an explanation of - how she got away with this without challenge?

AstraiaLiberty · 04/12/2017 10:10

Diagnosing a 2-year-old with anything gender-related is abusive. Oh look, this tiny child hasn't been correctly or sufficiently socialised into enacting regressive gender stereotypes, let's pathologise them.

And the binder thing - just replace it with 'tightlacing corset' and see if it's still progressive for teenage girls to impair their breathing because they want to change the shape of their bodies.

If I had read this ten years ago in a dystopian feminist novel I'd have thought it was a bit too far-fetched. Peak trans keeps peaking.

hipsterfun · 04/12/2017 09:40

But two-year-olds don’t know they’re born. Like, really!

notafish · 04/12/2017 09:11

big not bog

Swipe left for the next trending thread