What it's really like to be a parent of a transgender child - blog

As a social movement it comes down to boundaries and where they are in society. Can we be liberal to the point that everything is acceptable and should be respected?

Are you ok with a vulnerable teenaged male born but trans identified since the age of 3 person who is afraid of entering the men's toilets so comes into the womens?

Are you ok with respecting and supporting someone who wishes to dress as a woman and hang out in women's changing rooms for sexual pleasure, being aroused by any female who happens to be in there with him?

Are you ok with a middle aged adult male who wishes to dress as a female young child and perform sexual fetish in a changing room around women and children?

Are you ok with someone who wants you to accept and support them as a pedophile because that's their authentic self, they can't help being born that way and that's who they're happy being?

Where do you draw the line? At some point society has to say, who
matters most here? How do we decide who gets to indulge themselves to the detriment of others? How do we rank them? How big a detriment should we be ok with? What happens when those who are disadvantaged by this get angry with being disadvantaged and turn on those groups with better rights than they have?

These are things that need to be talked about and thought of before a whole lot of MPs vote thinking this is just a case of 'live and let live'.

no one should not be judged for being who they are or who they want to be.

Agree 100%. Wholly behind that. For everyone, without exception. I've never actually seen a post from anyone on MN who disagrees with that.

The thing is, that isn't the issue . The whole issue can be summarised as 'your right to wave your fist around ends at someone else's nose'. This isn't about live and let live, it's about a minority group pursuing specific legal 'rights' that will seriously impact, infringe upon and reduce the wellbeing of women and girls, and even worse upon children and their parents. It's about that group freely using extremely violent, anti woman rhetoric including a very high number of threats of rape and killing for women failing to conform.

I don't judge anyone for being who they are, presenting however they want. I massively judge and want nothing to do with anyone who threatens to rape or murder to further their political agenda - and I don't care what that agenda is. Violence is wrong. I massively judge male born people with zero respect or care for female born people, because they see female as lower status and want that enforced in law. I massively judge following a political agenda above child protection and safeguarding.

If you want to call me a bigot for that then I am really ok with it. It isn't hatred, it's about standing up and saying, these things are wrong .

*Pink not Punk

But don't you see, that makes you a "hateful transphobic bigot" like the rest of us. You are literally not allowed to question or critique anything.

This is what you said:

People have the right to dismiss their past if it's painful or because they don't want to associate with it and become a different gender/person or whatever. I don't understand the problem?

When the media ran a story about that sex offender who was transferred into a women's jail, but was subsequently removed for harassing women, all Punk News had to say was that he was being "deadnamed". Fuck his victims.

And posters on here then discovered accounts of his crimes had been legally supressed in partnership with Google.

Jellyfrizz
I think I see what you're saying.
But the second bit about society being more tolerant might take some time.
Really i don't know the answer at all, I just feel that no one should not be judged for being who they are or who they want to be.
Fair point though.

ALittleBitOfButter
I think you are talking about freedom of information here & no if someone has acted dangerously or irresponsibly if its in the public interest and it is true irrespective of gender it should be accessible.
I am saying that if a person wishes to live as a woman or man or neither then why not?

Emsmum do you think google should prevent people being able to access news articles from the past about sex offenders who have been convicted in the past? Should the Aussie Rules footballer transwoman have articles from the past rewritten that mention him being involved in breaking a woman's leg during play?

Many parents of trans kid blogs are honestly scary, with clear evidence the parent is manipulating the child into transition.

secretlyfabulous.wordpress.com/

This blog's got a mother who withdraws from her child and gets sad any time he doesn't want to be feminine or transition. The child, who has autism and seems to be in a co-dependent relationship with her, will back off and go back to female pronouns or whatever when she does it. He's trying to keep his fertility but she's clearly pressuring him into hormones that will diminish or destroy it.

...or to do the best thing for themselves & their lives, and live as the opposite gender that they were born to.
I just think we need to be more tolerant and move away from stereotyping children and adults to a particular gender now.

EMSMUM I agree with your second sentence here. Can you see how your first sentence is in direct conflict with that?

Think about it, without referencing stereotypes how do you 'live as the opposite gender'?
How about people just live how they want whatever sex they were born?

Trans isn't a temporary state of being as I understand it. Its not something that people choose, it is not about 'hiding history', you cannot wipe your medical notes in any case. I think its about identity - any adult can change their identity to some degree (like name changing) and have the right to do so. People have the right to dismiss their past if it's painful or because they don't want to associate with it and become a different gender/person or whatever. I don't understand the problem?

So long as someone is legally able to do so I honestly can't understand why it would be a problem for anyone else. ( I am btw talking about adults here).
I would suggest for most people they feel they have a choice between continuing to live in a state that they cannot tolerate or are comfortable in, or to do the best thing for themselves & their lives, and live as the opposite gender that they were born to.
I just think we need to be more tolerant and move away from stereotyping children and adults to a particular gender now. Its respecting how people feel and want to be viewed, and that can only be expressed by each of us individually and how we experience ourselves in the world.

Thanks Bucket - I was seemingly more informed of the risks than many (spoke to one woman who was given the first implant without even being told what it was) but there's still minimal reporting of side effects or understanding of long term implications.

Tammy So sorry this happened to you. Voices like yours to speak out on this are so important.

It actually breaks my heart that children are being given these drugs and that parents are not looking for unbiased information.

When I'd be suffering due to my course of zoladex, I started researching myself. There are thousands of women like me out there, irreparably harmed by these drugs. No one cares or wants to listen. How can they be fed such complete lies - safe, reversible etc? I fear they will have so much regret if they grow up and can barely maintain a career or relationship, their hormones never work properly causing physical and emotional issues, they have such bad fatigue they can barely move and the bones of a pensioner.

These drugs are licensed for a maximum of six months in adult endometriosis sufferers due to the risks associated with longer term use. This isn't a secret in the medical community. But it's okay to keep a child on them for years? How is that possible?

This makes me so angry. Bone density absolutely is not guaranteed to return to normal after cessation - mine hasn't. Perfectly safe? Don't be so ridiculous.

No they're not hormones. That would be one thing. This is essentially telling a developing brain to switch off certain functions. It's infinitely more harmful than giving hormones.

jelly that’s such a good point actually re medical history being erased. Why do they want this to happen, instead of just being happy and proud of their new identity. You often hear the phrase ‘coming out’ applied to trans people, yet it’s not really coming out at all, it’s hiding away the truth

the concern in its self suggests a transphobic premise that being transgender is an undesirable outcome. It's really not!

I agree. So, why do we need to have a mechanism that says people are legally a different sex? Why is it ok to change a birth certificate? To hide people's histories? There is nothing wrong with being trans so why fight for provision to hide the fact?

What I take from that blog is how vitally important it is for health professionals to be honest and tell the truth. And how dangerous it is when a vested interest group falsely style themselves as experts.

If I was a parent who was directed towards all this information that told me that my child could kill themselves, but don't worry there's a completely reversible drug that will save them, then I think I'd be so relieved I wouldn't even question it. Parents should be able to trust doctors and they should be able to trust groups that are recommended by the NHS (like Mermaids are) but they are being massively let down, actively lied to (re: suicide statistics) and are having dangerous truths hidden from them (side effects of puberty blockers).

Cross post with you OP. Massively agree with every word.

If your 13 year old came to you and said that they wanted to marry their boyfriend; they've always loved him; they are certain that they won't change their mind; it's all they want and if you don't let them, they will kill themselves because they will be so unhappy, they can't possibly wait three years to get married, what would you do?

You would not facilitate a marriage, you would tell them that they are too young to make such an important decision, but if they still feel this way when they are older they can go ahead and get married.

It's being called disrespectful to trans people and likened to 'conversion therapy' (which lets be honest, involved giving people electric shocks at one point to try and reverse their being gay, so was extreme stuff) to

a) discuss or offer any approach OTHER than transition which can very quickly involve life changing medication that has not yet been thoroughly researched and which long term effects are not known but could be very serious
b) to go with the previous policy of 'watchful waiting' which involved giving the situation support and time to see if it was a persistent idea or altered and developed (this can certainly involve the child living in a gender neutral or gender challenging way in terms of dress, name etc,)
c) to look at other possible reasons for those feelings and support those needs as part of watchful waiting, which seems sensible to me considering the very high population of trans identified people with diagnosable mental health needs, autism and a history of sexual abuse. It's going to be very difficult to support or treat those needs without at the same time working with their trans identity as at this time no one knows where one stops and the other starts.

Please, how is this disrespectful? A professional working with transgender teens and young adults recently gave evidence on this to the government, as part of which she quoted an email she had received saying simply 'please, how do I get my body back? And how do I go about sueing my doctor?' Surely the most respectful way to treat a child is with the utmost care, safeguarding and caution as decisions are being made on behalf of the future adult? Particularly as in five or ten years time this situation- which does involve social contagion - may be looked back on very differently.

Lobotomies were thought to be very progressive and a standard treatment at one point. Forcibly kidnapping children from certain groups to be 're trained' in government boarding schools to follow the current Right Think was thought to be a highly liberal and progressive idea put in place by acts of parliament. We're in the very, very early stages of understanding what is going on here and what the situation looks like for those children five years on, ten years on. Until that evidence is established the first responsibility has to be protecting children.

Ilove - my point (I can't speak for others) is that teenage angst - including disgust with one's changing body - is an entirely normal process for many, if not most of us. Most of us grow out of it and turn into normal, well adjusted adults who are more or less happy in our own skins. Being a teenager, frankly, sucks in very many ways.

Counsellors and psychiatrists are now increasingly concerned that they are unable to help teens through this phase in their life if their patient has expressed concerns about their gender. There was a great - if chilling - post on another thread in FWR recently from someone working in that area who spoke about how her colleagues were terrified of being labelled transphobic bigots if they didn't effectively support a teen with gender issues towards transitioning, rather than helping them to work through whether there was another, underlying problem.

I think in many cases, transitioning is treating the symptom not the cause. Girls who suffer homophobic bullying should be protected from that bullying rather than offered the possibility of opting out by "becoming a boy". Boys who are angry with how they see women being treated need help in resolving that underpinning feeling (probably anxiety). Or boys who are effeminate gay men should be supported in being effeminate gay men, rather than put on the path to becoming transwomen.

I don't think that there is anyone on here who doesn't believe that there are genuine cases of gender dysphoria. More that the prevailing orthodoxy at the moment is increasingly that anyone questioning gender presentation is probably trans, should be supported 100% to transition, and the drugs that teens and young adults can be given are completely safe and reversible - even though that is patently untrue.

Why is it patronising, LampandChair, to want other possible causes of teenage anguish to be considered as well as transgenderism?

DS could so easily have been led further down that route, honestly he could. Children and teenagers are immensely susceptible to what people tell them. They want to fit in (and be unique at the same time). They want an explanation for how they feel. They want 'their tribe'. They want quick fixes for problems. And they are children, so they have limited experience and very limited understanding of what they might be giving up.

the amount of you who think you know how to fix trans people is utterly shocking

I think the point is we don't think they need fixing at all Unlike the 'experts' from Tavistock, Mermaids etc.

He's just fine, thanks; he says himself that that was 'a really, really weird time' in his life.

Likening being trans to normal teenage angst is again, patronising.

Also the amount of you who think you know how to fix trans people is utterly shocking.