We need to talk about the GRA - Glasgow

Not able to share that link, sorry.

I really don't want to have to feel this paranoid, but being harassed, doxxed and intimidated has been part of this for a long time now for those who speak out.

And that is why it is understandable that people are careful. I'm going to see what I can do on one of my FB groups instead.

I'm watching some footage on GenderTrender - who is the woman with white hair? She raised points about Lesbian partners I found really interesting (and very sad) about them being denied their own identity when their partners transition. I was also unaware that the GRA ignore detransitioners. It only has her talk from the middle/near the end is there any other footage up with the talks in full does anyone know?

I’m also nervous about the documentary.

I really have no intention of trashing anyone or causing trouble. I just had some concerns about the way things were handled. I saw things differently when I watched it back rather than being there and felt the need to say it, but I will be more careful in future.

I agree with AssignedPuuurfect.

This is another reason that we need a private group.

But while we're on the subject - there are people who have themselves transitioned who do not support and some who actively and vocally oppose the trans narrative. And we don't want to find ourselves in an echo chamber.

In relation to using FB. I don't use a lot of social media, I use FB mainly for professional purposes, it's a source of a lot of information not only about me, but about other people I know, and it would be a massive pain in the arse to have to change it all if someone did set out to cause trouble.

I've only used WhatsApp occasionally, but from what little I know then it is potentially a way of communicating that can be easily discarded, changed if there are problems.

I really don't want to have to feel this paranoid, but being harassed, doxxed and intimidated has been part of this for a long time now for those who speak out.

Camomile
Do you really think it's a good idea to publicly trash the speaker? Seriously, a bit of restraint is required. At least PM stuff

I would have welcomed it if the speakers had concentrated more on the fact that a huge bit of legislation is to be change and in what ways and how that potentially affects ALL women.

It become too personal at times. And too much about toilets....

camomile where on FB was that about Ruth Greening? People make a lot of claims...

Oh, thread has moved on.

I'm not on FB, WhatsApp would suite me better.

I agree, the scuffle was horrible and badly handles.
Letting security deal with it would have been so much more sensible.

I loved Kate's presentation and her passion, but I do think that many 'normal' people who are not engaged in this issue might find her approach very off-putting. Whether we like it or not, to get our point across and heard and taken seriously we need to behave in the most adult, mature and assertive-but-not-aggressive way.

Not sure what you mean, about what I am doing?

the 'back up back up' Trans rap is a constant playing in my head.

Seriously Camomile, What are you doing?

Really interesting reading everybody's thoughts on the meeting

I do worry that these meetings are at risk of being a bit of an echo chamber with everybody (generally) being of similar opinions anyway, so all agreeing.

I find this whole subject so interesting and scary and I would very much welcome debate. I think Joanna once she had accepted that she could not dominate the debate, added an interesting perspective, so me anyway, as I have no idea what it is like to live as a trans person.

Clearly, a 3rd space is the answer and I truly don't understand why this whole debate must be so adversarial.

My favourite question of the night was from the young dark-haired women who asked how one of the male audience members protected himself from rape walking home on a dark night and how he dealt with the consequences of an unwanted pregnancy - she brilliantly put the shoe on the other foot IMO.

NB Yes, please, to an informal pub meet-up! I did not identify myself as a MNer and apart from Purrrfect have no idea who any of you are ('tits and fannies' comment was fab btw).

That's very interesting camomileteadrinker and yes, certainly the information came to me late in the day of where to meet initially so it would have been last minute organisation.

With regard to my comment about it working above - if that seemed confrontational it wasn't meant to. I just find it very frustrating that people can't meet without this fear. That said I do appreciate why you would prefer to stick to those attending. It is just frustrating that I was unable to attend because of work and now due to that I can't be involved in another way. Frustrating but understandable.

I hope your meeting is productive though.

Well its working isn't it?

Yes, we do need some way to organise obviously. I think many of us are going to get a lot more cautious when it comes to stuff like Facebook though because of the amount of real-life information you can see about someone on there. I don’t want activist groups like Wednesday’s lot to know where I work, live etc.

But making connections with other feminists is so important and we do need to be able to meet, talk, share experiences. That’s why there’s such a campaign to keep us scared and silent after all!

I’m not on FB but would be happy with a WhatsApp group.

My feeling is that for the moment, we should keep the group limited to the people who were actually there and can be vouched for by others. I can vouch for terryleather for example. If and when we meet we could discuss secure ways to introduce more people.

I am really paranoid about this because my job would be affected and I really love my job!

I’d also be interested to know about the Facebook groups that were infiltrated- what happened? What form did the infiltration take and what affect did it have?