We need to talk about the GRA - Glasgow

I hate to say it, but this change in legislation is going to go through and then an awful lot of women are going to have to suffer from very horrible assaults before anyone will even dare to look at the consequences of the new GRA on women. Unfortunately, the first few women who are attacked etc will be ignored by police, government and media for fear of reporting transphobic stories, and not wanting to admit have made a massive misstep

"Women only services....are likely to have risk management policies in place"

And

"The Scot Gov expects trans people to behave in an appropriate manner when using facilities."

Yay! All fine then.

Cracking line in a letter from Angela Constance

Oh my god.

I feel I've been transplanted into a different planet where things look the same but nothing makes sense anymore.

'By listening to all those who say the things we want to hear, and ignoring all the nasty bigoted women, I am confident that the Scottish Parliament will be able to fuck women over without too much objection'

By listening to all those who agree that trans equality and women’s equality are not in conflict or competition

I think I've just had a rage stroke.

"Listen, woman, I'll be listening only to the other women. The ones who agree with men. So you can eff the eff off."

A response from Patrick Harvie to an email sent to him describing the events on Weds evening, asking for his support in helping women meet and organise, and asking for his position on his MSP supporting the transactivists.

Thanks for your email.

As I wasn’t present to witness the events you’ve described, I can only acknowledge your own perception as well as the perception of those who have commented online about the other side of the story. I’m clearly not in a position to make a judgement about what happened or why.

I see nothing whatsoever in Ross Greer’s tweet to disagree with – it’s a simple statement of support for trans people, and opposition to transphobia. It was in reply to a question from someone whose account appears to comprise nothing other than anti-trans rhetoric, so I can understand why Ross wouldn’t care to engage in more detail on that occasion.

It’s very clear that feelings run high on this issue. I hope in particular that people will acknowledge the torrent of abuse and prejudice that trans people are living with in the present climate; their very existence is denied in the pages of major newspapers on a daily basis, and outright hostility to equality, such as misgendering people, is being presented in some circles as a legitimate expression of free speech.

To be clear, I have no reason and no wish to accuse you or your colleagues of this kind of behaviour. However I do hope that you will acknowledge that it is becoming not only mainstream but relentless in some parts of society, and inevitably has a profoundly harmful impact on trans people.

I am pleased to see broad support for the Scottish Government’s proposals for improved legislation on gender recognition, not only from trans and LGBT+ organisations but also from highly respected feminist and women’s organisations including Engender, Close the Gap, Rape Crisis Scotland, Equate Scotland, Scottish Women’s Aid, Women 50:50, and Zero Tolerance.

By listening to all those who agree that trans equality and women’s equality are not in conflict or competition, I am confident that the Scottish Parliament will be able to move forward with this issue positively.

Sincerely,

Patrick Harvie

I feel ambivalent about all this cloak and dagger stuff re venues etc and wonder whether it may not be more beneficial for our cause to have public meetings, announced in the usual way with tight but 'passive' security and an ironclad rule that nobody gets physically involved with anybody, let security deal with any trouble-makers from any ideological camp.

Shouting and fisticuffs is just embarrassing and juvenile and makes everybody involved look bad.
If there was an event in which TAs went all shouty and disruptive and that was caught on film and broadcast while women stood by and behaved sensibly, it may skew opinion in our direction. I hope.

The trouble is that once a venue is made public (or even just leaked) there is such a volume of calls, tweets and emails from TAs threatening to turn up and disrupt that the venue backs out, usually citing insurance concerns. It doesn't matter if only 4 TAs are actually planning to go, they'll send out a call and get people all over the country/world to contact the venue and harrass. Security costs a lot of money and venues' concerns over insurance are valid.

Also, of course, transactivists have been actually physically violent. I think it's a bit much to expect women to stand by and behave sensibly while getting punched. This is not a comment on the Glasgow talk BTW, I wasn't there and haven't seen footage of the altercation at the start.

PerfectlyDone Noted :)

I don't FB but would welcome a PM re any meet-up v much

I feel ambivalent about all this cloak and dagger stuff re venues etc and wonder whether it may not be more beneficial for our cause to have public meetings, announced in the usual way with tight but 'passive' security and an ironclad rule that nobody gets physically involved with anybody, let security deal with any trouble-makers from any ideological camp.

Shouting and fisticuffs is just embarrassing and juvenile and makes everybody involved look bad.
If there was an event in which TAs went all shouty and disruptive and that was caught on film and broadcast while women stood by and behaved sensibly, it may skew opinion in our direction. I hope.

Although, actually I think the biggest problem is that the vast majority of people, men and women, don't give too much of a shit about all this and are utterly unaware of what's going on.
What transpeople I know in RL are quite horrified by what the more extreme end of TA is up to in their name. They do NOT feel represented by those nutters and really just want to live their lives. Which are difficult enough without being lumped in with extremists.

Thank you to everyone who went and posted. I need to work again tonight but I'm going through catch up about it over the weekend

I imagine if you book an event then turn up and run a differently-named event the hotel can refuse you, probably some kind of public liability insurance issue or similar. Especially with an event likely to be protested.

I've just made a secret Facebook group. Please PM me or Redonionricedpotato if you would like to be added.

good idea ALLIS0N. They handled it well and didn't cancel even when getting harangued with phone calls telling them to. They're definitely on my list for booking stuff in future (or just getting drinks!).

I've booked venues for events before and they always wanted to know what the event was as well as what name it was booked in. So I don't think it'd be too hard to find out. I don't know, maybe there was a leak somewhere, but I don't think there's much point spending time speculating on deliberate acts by specific people like Venice or Joanna or the journalists when it could've just as easily been a phone call saying "oh hi, I'm coming to the We Need To Talk About The GRA event tomorrow, can you confirm if it starts at 6 or 7?"

It’s a good suggestion to phone or email the Central Hotel and thank then .

They neee to know that the people who attended are more likely to spend money there in future than the protestors outside.

I'm surprised though that Venice didn't book it in a different name, that can be the only way they would have found out?

They really are obsessed loons, aren't they.

I have no idea how they could have known that it was the Mercure, or found out the new venue, before any of the guests did.

Phoned up every hotel/conference venue in Glasgow and just asked them directly, I bet. Pretty sure that's what's happened at previous talks.

Joanna was chatting to Venice at Costa, I heard her saying that she wanted to come along even though they were on different sides.

The TAs knew that it was the Mercure from the day before, and they knew it was the Grand Central from 5.30 - look -

www.facebook.com/ACQueeScotland/

They were encouraging people from 1730 to harass the Grand Central Hotel.

I have no idea how they could have known that it was the Mercure, or found out the new venue, before any of the guests did.

I can't believe it was Venice who leaked it as I think she'd had to pay out of her own pocket for the new venue of the Grand Central.

Venice definitely didn't come with purple hair TRA. Venice and Joanna (red haired TRA who stayed) arrived together.

Leak might have come from Joanna then.

I'm also interested, but wasn't aware of the event.
I'd be surprised if people were dismissed from jobs just for discussing this issue. If women are so scared already, it doesn't bode well for the future.

AgentProvocateur and Lemonjello Are we a trio now...?

53rdWay No one checked tickets so once the activists knew the venue there was absolutely nothing to stop them coming into the room.

One of the three who was part of the demo inside was at the toilet at the same time as me with the TIM waiting outside for her but I didn't think they seemed any more nervous than anyone else.

People have the right to protest and it didn't stop the talk from going ahead in the end, but I think after Speaker's Corner there is now the worry of actual violence (and I don't mean misgendering )