Article Showing Autogynaphilia in Action

Buy women's underwear, get a thrill from women's underwear, enjoy shopping for women's underwear with your partner - all fine and dandy, whatever floats your boat.

Forcing an assistant to be part of this process - and indeed enjoying her discomfort - really really not OK

whycant I disagree. All you know is that the assistant didn't react, you don't know how they were feeling because their ability to express it is limited by their need to do their job.

It wasn't the same as if you were buying lingerie for yourself because that's not part of a sexual fetish (or if it is, it is indistinguishable from any other woman buying lingerie as far as the other people involved are concerned so they would not know). A man buying lingerie for himself is obviously indulging his fetish at the time he is buying it.

I'm not buying that you can't buy lingerie online. Returns policies are pretty easy to use.

FloraP - I've never managed to successfully buy lingerie online, neither has DP.

I think it's possible to do it in person respectfully and consensually, and the assistants we've had didn't seem in the least bit fazed. I got the impression it was a pretty common occurrence for them, in fact. We weren't creepy or winking at her or making it sexual in any way - it was the same as if I were buying lingerie for myself.

I had no problem with the story until the point where he winked at the assistant and didn't care if she didn't like it. That's where he crossed the line, for me.

I confess I'm struggling to see the distinction between autogynephilia and straightforward cross-dressing too.

That's disgusting and disgraceful that the teachers had to bring a human rights complaint to force the school to stop forcing them to participate in this man's fetish.

That's vile.

I used to work in a food shop. No one came in and made suggestive comments about what they would be doing with the yoghurt later, and it wouldnt have been appropriate if they had. Same with selling underwear. you;re there to sell the item, not participate in someones fantasy.

In any case, the assistant did not report being uncomfortable selling underwear; their voices are not recorded. Its his fantasy on display.
Its more likely the assistants are uncomfortable being around a man who is desperately trying to engage their attention. We're pretty good at picking up on that and it displays untowards intent.

Its shameful that so many men think their attentions are amusing, and react with hostility when we say we are uncomfortable. It shows mens ignorance about the risks we are constantly aware of; especially the risk of a situation escalating.

Joanne explains: ‘Every time I was in the house alone I would dress up.

“Love, did you manage to get the washing on and clear that drain while I was at the shops and picking up the dog from the vet?”

“Er, no, sorry.”

Haha Tt. You make it sound like shop assistants should be abiding by the retail version of the Hippocratic Oath

They are perfectly entitled to object to be an unwilling participant in someone else's sexual fetish

This situation with shop assistants is one of those situations where "consent" can mask a multitude of problems. Like Louis CK claiming he never showed a woman his dick without asking (which seems to be untrue but anyway) then now having a revelation that they weren't in a position to so no. There are some things that should not be asked because the person being asked cannot answer freely. If they are forced to say yes, the person who asked gets a free pass on whatever they are asking.

Involving a shop assistant in a sexual fetish is wrong, wrong, wrong.

Obviously he shouldn't be upsetting the staff like that but at the same time their job is to sell lingere, what right do they have to be uncomfortable about what their customers do and do not wear? Unless the customer is doing something overtly inappropriate (in which case I would hope that their manager would be the first to van the customer from the store) what is the issue? Their purpose there is purely functional. If they allow themselves to get emotional about it they really shouldn't be working there.

More legal protection than any women have. And that is going to cause us problems.

And they will be protected by hate crime legislation so we can't call it out. And women have no such protection.

Everyones sexual fantasies are pretty grim if youre not interested in the person sexually. I dont see this as any different to a woman buying lingerie for sex purposes, although I didnt think you were allowed to try it on

In this case, the process of buying and trying on the lingerie is part of his fetish. As is forcing unwilling shop assistants to play along. He is actively involving them in his sexual fetish without their consent and using them to fuel his wanking basically. Can you really not see the difference between that and someone buying lingerie to be worn during a later sexual encounter?

Branleuse
No, trans activists deny autogynephilia exists at all. The article is evidence that AGP does exist, despite the claims.
This thread is about how after gender self ID is introduced, AGP's will have legal protection to act out in public. More legal protection than any women have. And that is going to cause us problems.

Kinks are ok between informed, consenting adults. But its not ok to involve people who dont consent, especially not in public, including people such as shop workers who cannot object. That is abusive behaviour.

I don't see BDSM aficionados setting up consultancies to tell employers how to be more accepting of people who like being whipped.

Ha! Give it time. Especially as lots of trans people and gender snowflakes are into fetish/BDSM.

i thought there was a clearly defined difference between transvestites and transgender people. The article doesnt mention him wanting to be or thinking he is a woman.

Sorry I think i thought this thread implied that this is what trans is really, but i can see now that youre just saying that its grim and that he shouldnt be wearing womens underwear in public?

Branleuse Autogynephiles arent the same as transvestites. Transvestites like to cross dress, AGP's are narcissists. They start off by imagining themselves as women, and end up losing their sense of self in the fantasy. Its a long process spanning decades of their lives.

I don't see BDSM aficionados setting up consultancies to tell employers how to be more accepting of people who like being whipped.

Quite obviously you don't understand Bran

There's not an issue of itself with this bloke wanking in his bedroom in women's clothes, any more than there is an issue with him having candles dripped on his bollocks or whatever else he might be into, the issue is when the sexual fetish is enacted in public and denying it is a hate crime.

It is not cool to involve non-consenting people with your sexual fetishes.

Blokes have been dressing up in their wives' knickers for decades, it's only recently that we have been told that this makes them women and they need access to the female changing rooms at the gym.

I dont understand the problem tbh. I am gender critical, but i dont give a shit that some blokes get turned on by wearing womens knickers. Everyones sexual fantasies are pretty grim if youre not interested in the person sexually. I dont see this as any different to a woman buying lingerie for sex purposes, although I didnt think you were allowed to try it on

surely this is just a transvestite. Why are we using new words? Have people been trying to deny the existance of transvestites?

whycant why can't your P buy his lingerie online? Why does he need to involve a shop assistant? How do you know whether the shop assistant minds or whether they are concerned about losing their job and trying to be professional?