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Original poster

Explaining my gender criticalness to recently out trans friend

69 replies

Albadross · 25/10/2017 19:37

A colleague emailed me today to say he’d seen my recent tweets that are critical of trans activism and was nervous to tell me something because he didn’t want it to affect our friendship. I’ve never actually met him, but we’ve spoken on the phone so it is a little odd that he phrased it like that. He says he needs to learn more and I don’t think he’s part of the trans lobby so how do I explain things in a way that won’t make him feel like I’m questioning his feelings about himself?

Argh! Confused

OP posts:
LassWiTheDelicateAir · 26/10/2017 00:43

I'd play the "no sex, politics or religion in the officers' mess" card and say you just like to keep your personal views and your professional life separate

Wise words from Prickly

Regardless of who initiated it you are making an issue of it I want to be able to stand up and be counted to make trans people who are not like the Activists aware of what’s being said and done in their name. I don’t like to hide.

Original poster
Albadross · 26/10/2017 00:30

Lass he just said he needed to learn more and thought may we could discuss it. Not my suggestion.

OP posts:
Original poster
Albadross · 26/10/2017 00:29

Hmmm, this is so tough, I want to be able to stand up and be counted to make trans people who are not like the Activists aware of what’s being said and done in their name. I don’t like to hide.

OP posts:
LassWiTheDelicateAir · 25/10/2017 23:54

Be very careful. Very very careful

He’s a colleague, this is a work situation, he could very easily get you in massive trouble. And that might be his goal

Thirding it. Not because I think they are out to get you. This person is not a friend. They are a work colleague whom you have never met in person.

What is the point of this? You are looking to set this up from the point of view of a political discourse, albeit it is sexual and gender politics rather than politics politics.

As an employer there is something about this which makes me feel uncomfortable. I can imagine this going horribly wrong.

Original poster
Albadross · 25/10/2017 23:15

I know @branleuse - I've already told him explicitly that I accept him however he wants to present/identify. That's kind of the whole issue - how do I explain that this isn't an anti-trans thing at all, it's just a pro-women thing. I have trans friends aside from him but they're older transsexuals who are also gender-critical. He sounded like he wanted to know more so I thought maybe if I explained articulately why some women have issues, it would be a positive thing.

OP posts:
Branleuse · 25/10/2017 23:08

You can be gender critical AND still have trans friends. Theyre not all trans activists and they're not the enemy.

Original poster
Albadross · 25/10/2017 22:57

I should’ve made it clear - I’m employed elsewhere and I work on a consultancy basis for the company he works for, so we’re colleagues but the worst I stand to lose is a very infrequent bit of work I do on the side.

I don’t think he wants to have an argument, I’ve not said anything that isn’t factual on social media but I think it’s clear I am gender critical. I hate that even declaring facts could ever lose someone a job!

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DJBaggySmalls · 25/10/2017 22:35

Its not a big leap, dont discuss it with him, not even outside of work. Its a protected characteristic and you could lose your job.
Follow the advice Pricklyball gave and dont enter into any more correspondence.

Creamswirls · 25/10/2017 22:33

I spent so long writing that, that I cross posted with others saying the same thing. Blush

Creamswirls · 25/10/2017 22:32

Unfortunately I would be putting your Twitter onto private and taking a step back from this guy; certainly not having a discussion with him about your views - because unfortunately they will never agree with his. It’s a shame but I’d be very wary about disciplinaries etc. Sad but true.

deckoff · 25/10/2017 22:25

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

SharkSkinThing · 25/10/2017 22:04

With all due respect, deckoff, that's a big conclusion to jump to. Why would that be his intention?

I agree with what Garden has posted. Biology is not destiny, and there's a long way to go still with the acceptance of our transgender friends and colleagues.

If you are owning the identity of 'gender critical' on social media, then I think it's understandable that you may have to defend it to others with differing views. Not all transgender individuals will hold the same views as each other, obviously.

If you already have trans friends, perhaps he's hoping for an ally, not an enemy?

Bombardier25966 · 25/10/2017 21:48

Are you friends with your colleague on social media, or have they randomly come across your tweets? You need to be aware that what you post on social media can get you in trouble if your personal opinions reflect badly on your employer. The line between personal and professional is very much blurred nowadays. People have been dismissed for this (although I'm not aware of any cases in regard to trans issues, the same principles apply), but such cases would be judged on the individual circumstances, and whether the comments might be judged as discriminatory or not.

How long have you worked there?

As for what to say to your colleague? "I respect your decision."

PricklyBall · 25/10/2017 21:37

Seconding deckoff's comment, if you don't know him well and he's only a work colleague, I'd play the "no sex, politics or religion in the officers' mess" card and say you just like to keep your personal views and your professional life separate.

deckoff · 25/10/2017 20:52

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Original poster
Albadross · 25/10/2017 20:09

Sorry there’s a few words missing (I’m on a very busy train so typing isn’t easy) - he was nervous to tell me something and then said he’s just come out as trans

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Original poster
Albadross · 25/10/2017 20:07

Shark obviously I will listen - I know because he told me today! I’m not just making some wild assumption based on nothing. I’m extremely open minded and have trans friends already, but they’re also gender critical and supportive of the idea that they’re not changing sex in a biological sense or wanting to access female-only spaces.

Gardengeek I think it definitely will be a good thing because I want to understand why he feels as he does and hear from someone who isn’t in the trans lobby for once. I genuinely also think he’ll listen to what I say open-mindedly, but like you say because the definitions have been so blurred I’m worried anything I say might seem offensive. I want to ask whether he’s had any support with exploring why he maybe doesn’t identify with being male, but of course that might come across as patronising in itself.

OP posts:
GardenGeek · 25/10/2017 19:59

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

SharkSkinThing · 25/10/2017 19:45

Maybe listen to what your friend has to say before giving whatever opinion you think he is seeking? Be open minded? How do you even know he's transgender?

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