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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

I'm a gender critical feminist with a 'trans' child.

139 replies

Theoryofparenting · 24/09/2017 14:33

Just a question I've been wondering. I have 15 year old twins, both of whom are biologically female. However, one of them 'presents as male' and has done for a couple of years.

He tells me that TransActivists are stupid. He doesn't believe that people are born in the wrong body. He knows you can't change your sex. He doesn't 'identify as transgender'.

As a young child he would tell me that he was a boy, that he would be upset if he became a woman. I assumed it was a developmental phase (I was similar as a child), however as soon as puberty hit at 11 he went downhill. Eating disorders, self harm, depression, anxiety. He would never tell us the root cause until he came to us at 13 and told us how he was feeling. He does not have 'gender dysphoria' - he has 'sex dysphoria'. His feelings are not caused by gender roles/expectations.

When people ask about it, he tells them that he isn't 'transgender' as he never had a gender, just a sex. He says he feels more comfortable presenting how he does and that he strongly dislikes his body, not societies expectations.

He has never been to a gender therapist. He isn't on blockers or hormones. Anything like that is being delayed, by his choice as well as mine.

I strongly agree with the gender critical feminist point of view (as does he). We've been through so much because of how my child feels. He gets annoyed when people associate him with TransActivists, because he is nothing like them and disagrees with everything they say/do.

I made this thread to show that not all parents of 'trans' children agree with the agenda. All I want is for my child to be comfortable and happy. If anyone has any questions then I am more than happy to answer them.

OP posts:
AssassinatedBeauty · 26/09/2017 21:37

I don't feel female. I am female, that's all. It's like saying I feel like I have brown eyes, when I just do.

AssassinatedBeauty · 26/09/2017 21:36

No. I don't have a gender identity, please don't misgender me.

Level75 · 26/09/2017 21:35

AssassinatedBeauty if your sex/genetics is female and you feel like a female doesn't that make you cis?

AssassinatedBeauty · 26/09/2017 21:33

You need to get over to AIBU, or a BF/FF thread, or a SAHP/WOHP thread if you want to see aggro. Being told to bore off would be very polite!

Level75 · 26/09/2017 21:31

All this sounds like a bit of a semantic debate. I dont want to speak for ProudPapa but I thought his sex was female and his gender was male, so he's not saying he used his male sex/body to have a baby as that's not possible.

What does confuse me is why people are so wound up and rude about this, as in "oh bore off". I've not encountered this on other MN threads. Is it reserved for trans issues?

AssassinatedBeauty · 26/09/2017 21:27

Quite, @AlabamaShakes! I've had two babies and there's very little that is feminine about me!

I don't have a gender identity @Level75, I'm not non-binary, or trans, neither am I "cis". I'm definitely female/a woman though.

AlabamaShakes · 26/09/2017 21:12

Oh bore off Level. It's an open forum, people can ask anything they want and if ProudPapa doesn't want to answer then so be it.

TBH, I found it quite rude lumping femininity in with the ability to carry babies.

Datun · 26/09/2017 21:10

It must be hard psychologically but I can't see that it's controversial for a trans man to carry a baby.

Not sure what you mean by controversial. It's not about whether or not someone who has gender dysphoria has to work through it in order to give birth.

It's about the meaning of the word man and woman, male and female.

You can't just arbitrarily change it, when you are the living embodiment of it.

You can't just arbitrarily change it anyway. But when you are using your sexed body for the specific purpose for which it is designed, what's controversial is that you can then say you are the sex of the person with the opposite body.

Level75 · 26/09/2017 21:06

ProudPapa, I can't believe how rude people are being to you. Asking intrusive questions like how your husband feels about your transition like it's a surprise!

My understanding, and happy to hear other views, is that sex is fixed (setting aside intersex) but gender isn't. I know people who don't identify as either gender and those who identify as the opposite to their sex. It must be hard psychologically but I can't see that it's controversial for a trans man to carry a baby.

AlabamaShakes · 26/09/2017 20:58

I see, apologies if so Cakes

Datun · 26/09/2017 20:55

I think that was in reference to the opening post.

AlabamaShakes · 26/09/2017 20:46

Oops, is that a name change fail?

CakesRUs · 26/09/2017 20:45

He has a refreshingly honest perspective on it. Good luck to you all.

AlabamaShakes · 26/09/2017 20:43

ProudPapa

I am menopausal (only 36yr Shock) so therefore unable to carry children, nor am I typically feminine. I am still a woman.

You're confusing gender stereotypes (masculinity/femininity) with biological sex.

So you're a female who prefers the masculine look. No need for hormone treatment etc.

i do wonder if women go down this whole trans route so they're not mistaken for be a butch (hate that term) lesbian woman. Quite homophobic really.

Anyway, how does your husband feel about being a gay man if you're of the belief you can transition into a real man?

Datun · 26/09/2017 20:29

I am a man in every aspect except the way I look.

And have sex, get pregnant and give birth.

Rufustherenegadereindeer1 · 26/09/2017 20:29

sleigh

I'm just not sure anymore Grin

sleighbellend · 26/09/2017 20:26

Grin you're on the wind up aren't you ProudPapa

Rufustherenegadereindeer1 · 26/09/2017 20:24

Other people are being rude?

Have you reread the Ops comments proud

As they appear to be wanting their child to decide for themselves

You are being rude

ProudPapa · 26/09/2017 20:16

I will admit carrying my sons did cause some dysphoria, but all my life I had wanted children of my own and we couldn't afford a surrogate. I am starting hormones in a few months to fully transition. I am a man in every aspect except the way I look. It's quite rude to question my masculinity. Would you question the femininity of a woman who is unable to carry her own children?

AdultHumanFemale · 26/09/2017 10:20

sleighbellend , it's is all about self-identification. Anyone can 'identify' as the gender of their choice, and if this happens to be the opposing gender to that most commonly associated with your sex, then you are, by definition, a 'trans man' or 'trans woman' (though it is debatable whether or not there should be spaces between the 'trans' and the man / woman, as it does rather change the implied status). No hormones, surgery or medical 'gate keeping' necessary, hence the massive problem with the gender self-identification bill.

DixieNormas · 26/09/2017 10:06

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Fixmylife · 26/09/2017 10:05

Good article kalinka

This bit stood out for me -

she was unhappy as a child not because she was a boy trapped in a girl’s body but because she didn’t understand that she could be the kind of girl who hated girly things but loved other girls, without having to metamorphose into a man.

CharisInAlexandria · 26/09/2017 09:54

Hi ProudPapa, I am slightly confused by your post.

Obviously it was very wrong of your mum to say rude things about trans people. Though that's not what the OP has been doing.

But if your mum had encouraged you down the route currently being promoted then you would have had puberty blockers followed by testosterone which would have made you infertile so you wouldn't have been able to have any children.

Viviennemary · 26/09/2017 09:43

I don't even know what a gender critical feminist is. Your son sounds really confused.

Blossomdeary · 26/09/2017 09:37

Phew! - my brain hurts!