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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

I'm a gender critical feminist with a 'trans' child.

139 replies

Theoryofparenting · 24/09/2017 14:33

Just a question I've been wondering. I have 15 year old twins, both of whom are biologically female. However, one of them 'presents as male' and has done for a couple of years.

He tells me that TransActivists are stupid. He doesn't believe that people are born in the wrong body. He knows you can't change your sex. He doesn't 'identify as transgender'.

As a young child he would tell me that he was a boy, that he would be upset if he became a woman. I assumed it was a developmental phase (I was similar as a child), however as soon as puberty hit at 11 he went downhill. Eating disorders, self harm, depression, anxiety. He would never tell us the root cause until he came to us at 13 and told us how he was feeling. He does not have 'gender dysphoria' - he has 'sex dysphoria'. His feelings are not caused by gender roles/expectations.

When people ask about it, he tells them that he isn't 'transgender' as he never had a gender, just a sex. He says he feels more comfortable presenting how he does and that he strongly dislikes his body, not societies expectations.

He has never been to a gender therapist. He isn't on blockers or hormones. Anything like that is being delayed, by his choice as well as mine.

I strongly agree with the gender critical feminist point of view (as does he). We've been through so much because of how my child feels. He gets annoyed when people associate him with TransActivists, because he is nothing like them and disagrees with everything they say/do.

I made this thread to show that not all parents of 'trans' children agree with the agenda. All I want is for my child to be comfortable and happy. If anyone has any questions then I am more than happy to answer them.

OP posts:
Datun · 26/09/2017 22:43

But Level

If you asked me if I feel male or female though I'd say female.

What does that even mean? Think about it.

If one has a female body all one's life, one will have an intimate knowledge of it. Everything it does, the way it's treated, and the way people treat you because of it.

There is literally nothing else to 'feeling female'.

You have to play this out, in your head.

What else is there? Seriously. One word. Nurturing? Floral? Strong? Empathetic? Ambitious?

For every stereotypically female characteristic, I can give you 100 women who don't have it. The same with men. It's not innate. It's personality.

The only reason you feel female is because of your body.

Trans people have a disconnect over their body. It's a disorder. It's awful.

But it doesn't make them a different sex. They can pick any number of gender characteristics and employ them, while still being the sex they are.

But they don't because society tells them certain characteristics need to apply to certain body.

So because they feel of those those characteristics best describe them, they assume their body is wrong.

Gender is damaging.

You can't 'feel' female without being female.

AlabamaShakes · 26/09/2017 22:30

And that's the problem with this programme. They don't show the aftermath and all the things that can go wrong.
It's all presented as hunky dory and as a means to an end and the person who had the surgery lives happily ever after, when in fact they have a lifetime of problems.

Rufustherenegadereindeer1 · 26/09/2017 22:29

vivienne

I think its been going for many years...to what extent i dont know

Viviennemary · 26/09/2017 22:24

I didn't watch the surgery part. I wonder how long this reassignment surgery has been performed. I can't think it's more than a few years. A lot of doctors disagree with it I believe.

AlabamaShakes · 26/09/2017 22:15

I saw a bit of that programme. Unfortunately it was the reassignment surgery, it looked horrific. I feel for anyone who feels so at odds with their body that they would go through with that, but at the same time I think it's important to show the younger generation this kind of programme so they can see how extreme this all is and it's only mimicking a vagina, it isn't a real vagina.

It's so important that vulnerable people are able to access therapies to help them come to terms with their biological bodies and not be defined by gender stereotypes but the TRA's don't want that. It's alarming.

Orlandointhewilderness · 26/09/2017 22:15

Oh dear God this hurts my brain!
Good luck to your DC.

Rufustherenegadereindeer1 · 26/09/2017 22:07

So if someone meets the definition of one sex then I'm not being rude if i refer to them as that sex

See I thought it was considered rude not to use the pronouns, for example, that someone prefers

Viviennemary · 26/09/2017 22:07

That Horizon programme was on about Transgender just at 9 pm. I watched some of it. I admit I really don't understand it at all. It's girls saying because they don't like 'girly things' they identify as boys. And this doctor was seeing children as young as three. I am getting the stereotyping issue a bit though.

AssassinatedBeauty · 26/09/2017 22:02

Are you refusing to accept my self defined identity? Why do I need you to tell me if I meet your definition?

I don't feel female or male. I just feel like me. Cis is offensive to me as it implies I'm A-OK with the stereotypes associated/imposed on me because of my sex.

multivac · 26/09/2017 22:02

If you meet the definition of something

Whose definition? And of what?

Rufustherenegadereindeer1 · 26/09/2017 22:00

If you meet the definition of something (and I don't have enough info to assess that) then why is it rude?

Isnt this part of the whole 'problem' of discussing these issues

Rufustherenegadereindeer1 · 26/09/2017 22:00

Agree with alittlebitofbutter except i prefer a lot of butter

Level75 · 26/09/2017 21:58

The stereotypes associated with my sex don't form part of my personal identity either. Most people would class me as unusual in that regard. If you asked me if I feel male or female though I'd say female. I can imagine, and have heard enough from others first hand, that in another life I'd feel male, despite my body. Or I'd feel I was neither (as a friend did).

If you meet the definition of something (and I don't have enough info to assess that) then why is it rude?

ALittleBitOfButter · 26/09/2017 21:57

I'm a slow typer too Grin
I absolutely don't have a sense of personal identity that corresponds to the stereotypes imposed on women by the patriarchy.

My personal identity corresponds to my personality. Why does my personality have to be defined by 57 ridiculous statements invented by someone or other?

I'm just me. Not "ciswoman".

multivac · 26/09/2017 21:53

Surely you either do or you don't so if your sense of personal identity and gender corresponds with your birth sex you're cis right?

Jesus. Do people really think it's that simple? Are the boxes so inescapable now?

Datun · 26/09/2017 21:51

Level75

Gender is a set of stereotypes. Characteristics, behaviour or presentation.

People who are trans reject those stereotypes, not by saying they want a different set of stereotypes, but saying acquiring a different set of stereotypes makes them the opposite sex.

The problem at the moment, it's not that they want a different gender to the one that is typically assigned to them, is that they say they are biologically the opposite sex. That their brain determines what sex they are, not their body. Hence female penis.

Cis indicates that you are happy with the set of stereotypes typically assigned to you by society on the basis of your sex. That you identify with them.

Feminists know they are women, but they reject the stereotypes anyway. Therefore their body and the stereotypes are absolutely not in alignment.

Rufustherenegadereindeer1 · 26/09/2017 21:48

Watching!!!! Watching!!!!! Bloody hell

Rufustherenegadereindeer1 · 26/09/2017 21:48

Wow I'm a slow typer

Distracted by the film I'm waiting to be fair

AlabamaShakes · 26/09/2017 21:48

And please don't use Cis. That is rude and there is no need to use labels

ALittleBitOfButter · 26/09/2017 21:47

I am a man in every aspect except the way I look. It's quite rude to question my masculinity. Would you question the femininity of a woman who is unable to carry her own children?
You are not a man in every aspect except the way you look Hmm
Also, what does femininity have to do with gestating? Confused
I don't do anything feminine but I'm still a biological woman.

Rufustherenegadereindeer1 · 26/09/2017 21:47

level

assassinated said that she doesn't have a gender identity

A lot of people on this board especially say the same

nauticant · 26/09/2017 21:47

Just how if you fancy your birth sex you're gay

So a relationship between a transwoman and a man is a gay relationship? I suspect that would be viewed as transphobic.

AssassinatedBeauty · 26/09/2017 21:46

It's not hard to understand. I don't have a sense of gender identity. I'm just me. I happen to be female. The stereotypes associated with my sex don't form part of my personal identity.

AlabamaShakes · 26/09/2017 21:44

So questioning the trans ideology when it directly affects women is rude and you're wondering why women get wound up? (Although I'm not actually wound up atm)

Ive seen a hell of a lot worse than bore off on MN. Even on the Christmas threads.

Level75 · 26/09/2017 21:43

So are you saying you don't meet the definition of cis? Surely you either do or you don't so if your sense of personal identity and gender corresponds with your birth sex you're cis right? Just how if you fancy your birth sex you're gay.