Robert Webb: ally or grandstander?

58 replies

arousingcheer · 13/09/2017 13:11

I'm not claiming to support/refute his views as I haven't read the book (just some excerpts). But my spidey senses are tingling. I admit I'm suspicious when everyone genuflects when a fella says something along the lines of 'Hey chaps, let's scratch the surface of this patriarchy gig and you'll see it's not all it's cracked up to be!' (Oh, you mean the patriarchy hurts everyone? Alert the authorities!)

My first thought was that it was a bit of grandstanding/exceptionalism to write your memoir centred around the concept of performative masculinity as though you have discovered it. There is a little bit of that thing where a bloke thinks he's being top-notch by saying 'Look how comfortable I am in my sexuality!' And I'm having trouble expressing why I rolled my eyes when he writes about what a badass his wife was in labour and using power tools. Like, is that not reductive and verging on biological essentialism in itself? And in a tiresomely predictable way (which may not reflect at all on RW himself) it has provoked a lot of chin-stroking about things women have been saying for ages, but, yk, it needed to be said by a man for anyone to hear it.

Is he being the kind of ally who amplifies the voices of those who stood up and said this stuff before he did, who taught him what he knows? Or is he bashfully shielding his eyes from the spotlight and allowing himself to be congratulated on how right-on he is?

Sad to say I feel a tiny bit the same way about Hannibal Buress making his name off the Bill Cosby rape allegations. No one heard it until he said it and didn't his career take off because of it. It has its own section on his Wiki page: 'The audience appeared to respond to Buress's accusation as an incredulous joke before he encouraged everyone to "Google 'Bill Cosby rape'" when they got home.' I sort of love him so I wouldn't like to think it was a calculated career move... but was it?

OP posts:

deydododatdodontdeydo · 13/09/2017 14:21

He can either a) write a typical male, mysoginist, laddish book (there are tons out there, b) write a neutral book ignoring all these issues, c) write the book he has about performing masculinity, etc. (also haven't read it).
In terms of making an impact on sexist society, patriarchy, a) and b) do nothing, so even if he's only doing it to sell books (hard to tell), it's a good thing I think.

MephistophelesApprentice · 13/09/2017 14:12

He's a decent writer who's worked out what virtue he can get away with flashing without anyone calling him on it.

Never trust a male feminist.

squishysquirmy · 13/09/2017 14:10

I like him. Not read his book, but heard bits of it and heard him interviewed on womens' hour and he seems genuine. Yes, his book is not necessarily revealing anything new but as far as I can tell he isn't claiming it is - it is a personal memoir. And he seems to have been very honest about himself being less than perfect. It can be galling when men like him are listened to more than women making the same point but that isn't his fault at all - I am glad he is using his voice to bring attention to the issue of toxic masculinity.

Puffpaw · 13/09/2017 14:05

I liked the spoof ad he did about women needing to sort themselves out, and men already being brilliant. I think he gets it.

ArcheryAnnie · 13/09/2017 13:43

I don't like the concept of "ally" (as it's what you do rather than what you are), but I think he's OK, and broadly on the side of the angels, rather than being "Behold! Here am I, a man, saying something new!"

BertieBotts · 13/09/2017 13:41

TBH, I don't think he's really intending to stand up and make a huge deal out of being a feminist, he's just written a book where he acknowledges sexism. It's more that because he's a man, this is seen as unusual, and the media has jumped on it as a huge feminist statement, when he's really just done the same as many women do in their own memoirs.

QuentinSummers · 13/09/2017 13:38

Nother thread here www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3030454-Robert-Webb-is-a-bit-of-a-TERF

QuentinSummers · 13/09/2017 13:36

I also haven't read the book but heard him talk. I hope he's had the "scales falling" that many feminists do and so feminism is important for him and is genuinely a big part of his life.
Sadly we need men to talk out otherwise it's just painted as "strident Feminists
I think it's also really important to talk about how a patriarchal society impacts men.

Unflip

1 2 3