Why are feminists so aggressive?

There's no need to run away Martha. If you don't agree with radical feminism there's nothing wrong with that.

Fixed that Because, lets be honest here, it's radical feminism that can tend to give off an 'anti-male' vibe at times. (I appreciate it's not intended that way, but it's clearly the way it comes across.)

Also this - Be assured that feminists will continue to fight to gain and protect every right you have regardless of how you feel.

More of that infantilising I was talking about. It's very 'there, there dear, just you let the more educated feminists do what we know is right for you and we'll just keep ignoring your dissenting opinions.'

I hear this all the time - please, please, point some out!

I think some people just don't like it when women point out that like 90% of violent crime are committed by males. (Men are apparently allowed to say this, otherwise I suppose we'd not have any statistics on it at all)

Or when women point out that men, as a class, oppress women, as a class.

It is almost like they never really paid attention at what men say about women.
The anti-female vitriol is omnipresent, but acknowledged by ... pretty much no one.

Because if you disagree vehemently with people on the Feminism board it becomes very unpleasant indeed.

If you continue to argue your point you get called a handmaiden, troll and it becomes very personal indeed. Quite unpleasantly so. Apparently there were a fair number of reports that I was a man imposing that night, despite the fact I was posting in my regular name with a long consistent posting history. It was so unpleasant I name changed and never ventured on the femonism boards again. I did however have one poster apologise and a few pm from people who agreed but didn't feel confident enough to post.

As always when a group of people gather together there develops a party line. It makes people feel they are more right when someone else agrees with them. Pack mentality takes over. People who disagree slowly slip away. It's how a movement gains strength but animosity also.

As far as can see it's mostly one section of the population railing about how another section of the population telling you how to think dress speak etc.... whilst doing the exact same thing themselves.

Turned me right off feminism.

Unfortunately their experience of reading about or talking about the subject among their generation is that feminism = anti male

Out of interest, how old are they?

It's certainly not my experience amongst my generation. Most of my friends are libfems, some are radfems, some are male and identify as feminist allies. Not a single one is anti-male.

But what she said happened didn't happen.

Didn't it?

Which part of it didn't happen?

I wasn't nit-picking, I was responding the actual point that was made. Starting a campaign to have a person kicked off campus for not using more 'neutral' word than history is total nonsensical and makes the whole thing look pointless. It entirely misrepresents the whole event, so it's not just some small thing.

In answer to your second part, I find it surprising that in 2017 educated people have to be told not to use sex-specific words. I think if they had to do it, they had to do it, but really they shouldn't have had to do it.

There's no need to run away Martha. If you don't agree with feminism there's nothing wrong with that. Be assured that feminists will continue to fight to gain and protect every right you have regardless of how you feel.

I looked up that Cardiff Metropolitan story and there's nothing there about the word history.

Yes, you are correct, but the poster was probably doing it from memory, so I feel you are probably nit-picking just a little bit. It was six months or so ago.

So, please tell us how you feel about banning certain words because they are perceived as "sexist".

anti male vitriol

I hear this all the time - please, please, point some out!

I looked up that Cardiff Metropolitan story and there's nothing there about the word history.

You can read the whole policy document online if you want (I googled for it) - actually, it comes across quite thoughtfully, nothing unreasonable there at all (unless you think it's your goddess given right to use gendered words for people anyway!)

Well I daren't post on here. Even on this thread the tone is confrontational and aggressive.
I'm 59 and grew up believing I was a feminist. Read about feminism and have always tried to challenge stereotypes. Tried to bring two sons up to recognise inequality and to be feminists.
Unfortunately their experience of reading about or talking about the subject among their generation is that feminism = anti male (sorry don't know the opposite of misogyny).

I never associated being a feminist with the anti male vitriol I read on MN. I guess maybe that means I'm not a feminist.

Then surely mockery is the only sensible response?

Surely mockery is never a sensible response to somebody having a different point of view to your self?

I'm an aggressive feminist because sitting there tossing my hair and thinking "why oh why am I not treated as an equal" has done fuck all, so it's time for toughness, aggression and action.

Of course, if I was male I'd be a born leader with excellent assertiveness and determination. But I'm female, so I'm an aggressive shrieking harpy feminazi.

The biggest thing that secures equality is economic and political stability, fair distribution of resources, and legal protection. Ie the structures that are attacked as being 'the patriarchy

That made sense until you added that ridiculous sentence about the patriarchy.

Fair distribution of resources is not something that's happening in the patriarchy.

Exhibit A: Prostitution. Prostitution is the effect of a lack of fair distribution of resources.

Very obvious in that the males who have sex with women they aren't attracted to for the money (I hesitate to call it prostitution as the power dynamics are very different and the women may often not know what is going on) are typically from very poor country, and the women who pay them are from very rich countries.

Prostitution therefore, seems the result of a very steep inequality in distribution of resources. It would be interesting to see some study on the prevalence of prostitution and the distribution of wealth in different countries.

An argument could be made that abolishing the patriarchy via a revolution would lead, temporarily, to more male violence - but most feminists I know aren't proposing a typical revolution as solution, anyway. (The only ones who do that are also communists, which might explain it.)

Patriarchy also does not provide any legal protection to women, and as for economic stability ... um, no. Just no. The one country that took steps to ensure economic stability in the future is Iceland, a country that's ... not exactly the most patriarchal country there is.

I looked up that Cardiff Metropolitan story and there's nothing there about the word history.

"using the word history instead of something neutral can get a national campaign going to have you kicked off a campus"

It's political correctness gone mad, I tell you!"

So, you ask what I perceived as a genuine question, and a poster offers her point of view (that you obviously disagree with), and so you take the piss out of her, rather than counter her points. And you wonder why you are seen as "aggressive".

The university in question, BTW, was Cardiff Metropolitan

You also stated, in answer to the below

"also I have seen posters mocked if they don't understand something or can't explain themselves"

"I have never, ever, ever seen this"

Well, you just did it in your own post.

Now do you know what she means?

Spartacus, I’ve never seen any vitriol thrown at ex-prostitutes who have experienced coercion and PTSD and would never act that way myself.

There’s a wide spectrum of experiences in sex work, and most liberal feminists and sex workers recognise that. But I’m not looking to derail the thread into another discussion about sex work.
Just offering up a perspective on why feminists may be regarded as ‘aggressive’.

Fair enough. I personally find it difficult to reconcile feminist views with sex work but it's not for me or anyone else to say whether you're a feminist or not.

I did say 'some feminists' in my second line there Sparrow (in anticipation of your comment!)

I'm not saying all feminists should agree at all times.

I've seen some nasty vitriol from lib fems, including sex workers, spewed at women who have exited prostitution and who challenge their wine and roses view of it and instead talk about coercion and PTSD....

Feminists aren't all of one mind though Brazen. It's not essential for every feminist to agree with you or for you to agree with them. Names shouldn't be called etc but it is to be expected that there will be ideological disagreements - it's not a matter of us all just quietly smiling at each other.

I consider myself a feminist. However, I’m also a sex worker.
When some feminists see that I’m of the ‘happy hooker’ variety, rather than the ‘vulnerable, drug addicted, abuse victim’ stereotype, I am treated with utter contempt.

The insults I (and other sex workers) have had thrown at us on the feminist board here are some of the worst insults I’ve ever seen sex workers subjected to.

To me, feminism is about improving the real-world safety and well-being of all women. Not slinging ideological mud at women who have made different choices with their own lives or bodies. And certainly not trying to tell other women that their consent isn’t true consent, or that their choices and opinions aren’t their own. It removes personal agency and is completely infantilising.

It’s this kind of attitude that pushes women away from feminism and attracts the ‘why are feminists so aggressive?’ comments.
Feminism isn’t seen as welcoming or understanding to different experiences and viewpoints, and there really is a sneery undertone towards anyone less educated or less able to express themselves articulately.

The biggest thing that secures equality is economic and political stability, fair distribution of resources, and legal protection

This woke me up!!