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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Why are feminists so aggressive?

736 replies

BertrandRussell · 07/09/2017 14:11

This, or something like it, it always being asked. People say that the FWR board on here is scary and hounds out people whose faces don't fit. That women are always being told they can't be feminists if.......And so on. And so on.

In my experiences, you are much more likely to get an aggressive response if you express a feminist point of view than the other way round. Is it just me? Or am I missing something?

There have been plenty of interesting feminists threads recently, where everyone seems to be holding their own- but the same old accusations keep coming up.

OP posts:
Datun · 08/09/2017 12:23

But the comment on there talked about other women having 'little jobs', who couldn't possibly sustain a family. This is feminists' talking. No-one could think they talk like that in all seriousness! And there were loads of comments from women who were the main breadwinner.

I realise that sometimes words on a page can be misinterpreted. But it's a little unfair to apply misinterpretation as the issue to FWR, when other boards are downright insulting. With no misinterpretation necessary.

YetAnotherSpartacus · 08/09/2017 12:21

In relation to Horrid's examples I think we need both irony and sarcasm flags in the emoticon box.

AssignedPerfectAtBirth · 08/09/2017 12:21

I dislike a lot of the shit that is going on 'The Left' at the moment. I used the quotes because that term is used as though it's one homogeneous group, and is certainly referred to by 'The Right' as such and vice versa.

I read a lot of political material, right and left and they all talk about the other as though there is a characteristic quality and one defined movement. It isn't. I am left wing but disapprove of Antifa and identity politics. Doesn't mean I'm anti-Left. Doesn't mean I am to be thrown out of The Left Wing Club. If some left wing people want to patronise me and say I'm not left enough, let them crack on, I don't care. I'm still left wing.

And the 'The Left' and the 'The Right' men are fairly united in their contempt for 'The Feminists'. Funny that.

WhenSheWasBadSheWasHorrid · 08/09/2017 12:13

Ooh x post with datun

I just said they are probably joke posts. But it can be hard to tell, that particular thread wasn't a lighthearted thread. There's no Grin to indicating the posters is taking the piss.

Bertrand asked why feminists on fwr sometimes come across badly. I've given some examples.

Those two posts jarred with me a bit and I used to spend quite a bit of time on fwr, so I'm possibly more used to the style than others. There's a chance other posters dislike the tone of those and similar posts.
You see it a lot on other threads people make an effort to put lighthearted in the title or add a Grin to their comment because they know how easy it is to take something the wrong way on a forum.

AssignedPerfectAtBirth · 08/09/2017 12:07

Actually, I think it's like a poor argument against any group that is disapproved of. Same as those who judge other groups like Christians or Muslims. Gasp, sex before marriage - You are all hypocrites! Somehow if you are in a group that someone disagrees with, you ALL have to be perfect, lest the whole group is damned.

WhenSheWasBadSheWasHorrid · 08/09/2017 12:07

Can't say I go on style and beauty much.

I would be surprised if when talking about stay at home dads. Posters start suggesting they are all misogynists and their wives will be grateful when they die early. Seems a bit strong.

I think in that case the posters probably meant it as a joke. But it can be hard to get across your meaning in text form (that's why these Grin are useful).

Datun · 08/09/2017 12:07

Those examples are tongue in cheek.

I certainly wouldn't take them seriously. No one thinks that people's husbands should die, however misogynistic. And no one thinks women can't be the breadwinner.

BertrandRussell · 08/09/2017 12:01

I'm actually glad to have examples. But I'm now caught between a rock and a hard place. The example given seem to me to be the sort of thing that would not raise the mildest of comment on any other board. They would be considered mild in Style and Beauty.However, I know if I say that , I will be accused of dismissing or minimising.

It really does seem to me that feminists are held to much higher standards than other posters.

OP posts:
WhenSheWasBadSheWasHorrid · 08/09/2017 11:40

I think the op was 'why' not 'show me

So you aren't actually going to address my comments. Just dismiss them because the op didn't say "show me" Hmm

AssignedPerfectAtBirth · 08/09/2017 11:30

No I didn't misinterpret it. But of course you are always right. It's not surprising that you have such an issue with feminists really

scaryclown · 08/09/2017 11:29

I think the op was 'why' not 'show me'

WhenSheWasBadSheWasHorrid · 08/09/2017 11:27

Some examples of posts from other threads in fwr that I think don't come across well.

The thread is about a telegraph article about men's health suffering when their partner is the breadwinner.

But from the woman's point of view, at least their misogynist husband is going to die earlier

Just unpleasant. This was an article about men whose partners are the main breadwinner. A lot of these men are probably sahp. But these men are misogynists and it's best they die earlier.
This was not challenged on the thread.

And anyway there simply can't be that many examples of this. Women don't earn that much with their little jobs. Not enough to support a family

Another comment where the poster questions how they found enough female breadwinners to complete such a study.
Obviously there are more male breadwinners than female ones, but this post makes it sound like they are as rare as hens teeth and they aren't. I personally know 3 couples where the dad stays at home and the mum has a well paid job.

These are the kind of posts that irritate me. Probably absolutely fine for most though but you asked for examples.

Seachangeshell · 08/09/2017 11:26

Anyway, time for a bit of real life.
I'm outta here.

BertrandRussell · 08/09/2017 11:26

Why are feminists held to much higher standards than any other group on Mumsnet?

OP posts:
Seachangeshell · 08/09/2017 11:26

No I really don't! You misinterpreted my use of that word too.

AssignedPerfectAtBirth · 08/09/2017 11:22

Ha ha ha.

" it's your interpretation of my posts" - and you don't see the irony of this, given Staunchgate?

Seachangeshell · 08/09/2017 11:21

And a non-regular poster has been patronised on this thread. She was not a regular. It definitely happens on FWR.

Seachangeshell · 08/09/2017 11:20

No I'm being piled on for the use of the word staunch! Not for being passive aggressive
If you think I am passive aggressive it's your interpretation of my posts. It's easy to misinterpret things in writing. I'm being straightforward and honest about what I think. Sometimes I've asked rhetorical questions. Is that what you find passive aggressive?

BertrandRussell · 08/09/2017 11:19

Sometimes words have connotations for individuals that others could be expected to know about. "Staunch" appears to be one. But explanAtions have been given and accepted. Move on?

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AssignedPerfectAtBirth · 08/09/2017 11:16

No you haven't been piled on. Read your own posts fgs, you are being very passive aggressive.

I agree with you that being patronising is not constructive. I also don't 'conform' to one type of feminism' although do agree with a lot of rad fem stuff. I haven't been told to run along or been patronised, far from it. I find the FWR boards intellectually challenging and I have always been welcomed, and that stands for me posting under a variety of usernames, as I am a prolific namechanger.

I dislike the term patriarchy, I wear makeup, shave my legs, have been a SAHP, changed my name., have a joint back account Still haven't been patronised, Certainly there are some feminists who have strong views about these things. Which is fine with me

YetAnotherSpartacus · 08/09/2017 11:16

I'm lost, but to me, the word 'staunch' is an accolade mostly (unless it is paired with a negative practice).

Seachangeshell · 08/09/2017 11:07

Ah I see I have been totally piled on.

Seachangeshell · 08/09/2017 11:06

Oh well, I was using it in terms of the dictionary definition. But now I can see that people will take it the wrong way, so I'll use another phrase:
Feminists who are steadfast in their beliefs and have largely made their minds up on most issues.
I am undecided on many aspects of feminism, but I am definitely a feminist.
assigned I have not objected to aggression, but I do not like people being patronising.
It belittles other women and sounds like the patronising person is saying 'you are too stupid to join in with this conversation, perhaps you should run along now'.
I object to this because it's men who often patronise women as a way to keep us in our place.
I think we should avoid it when we talk to each other and rise above it.

BertrandRussell · 08/09/2017 11:01

No- it's in a snippet with the old ladies- "ooh she's a staunch" " yes she is-she's a staunch" and so on. At a time when certainly in my memory, staunch was only used about Loyalists or Republicans......

OP posts:
AssignedPerfectAtBirth · 08/09/2017 10:57

Is it the Black Knight one?